Lookup, Liverpool Records. Eliza McDonald

[Blue70]

Edward's age is 1 not 1 month I noticed this the other day and submitted a correction on Ancestry so at some point in the future it will appear on there.


Blue

[dickiesam]

Thanks for the clarifications Bert and Blue. Out of the 3 registrations in early 1850 the June one looks promising. My post has been amended.

Births Mar 1850:
Williams, Edward - W. Derby 20 1007
Williams, Edward - Liverpool 20 273

Births Jun 1850: Williams, Edward - Liverpool 20 413

Applying for a birth cert and specifying parents' names could tell you what name Eliza(beth) used when [or if] she married John Williams.

[Bertieone]

Likely to be coincidental, but,

The 1861 census has John Williams, Warehouseman and family living at Ray St. The 1851 census has them living at St Paul's Square, within spitting distance of Ormond St. The 1848 marriage below, John Williams, Warehouseman, Ray St, Elizabeth Jones, Widow, Ormond St.

Is it possible Elizabeth remarried using her maiden name?

Clutching at straws springs to mind.

[dickiesam]

Is it possible Elizabeth remarried using her maiden name?

She names her father as Watkin Jones but declares herself a widow? I was thinking she may have used her maiden name when she remarried but Joneses do marry Joneses!

And talking of straws.....
The 1841 has 2 Watkin Jones in Anglesey of an age to be Elizabeth's father. If memory serves me correctly Elizabeth claims to be from Amlwch and one of these Watkins is there.
HO107 Piece 1364 Book 3 Folio 64 Page 14,
and Amlwch: HO107 Piece 1362 Book 2 Folio 60 Page 24

[Alison C]

I think that marriage between John Williams and Eliza Jones may be the right one . Here is another baptism from Lan OPC for John and Eliza with the middle name of Watkin after her father:

Baptism: 16 Mar 1853 St Paul, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
John Watkin Williams - son of John Williams & Elliza [sic]
Abode: Kellys Place, St Pauls Square
Occupation: Porter
Baptised by: Thos. W. Jones
Register: Baptisms 1846 - 1864, Page 74, Entry 5
Source: LDS Film 1656373

Alison

[Bertieone]

Another option if applying for a Birth Cert is Sarah Jane Williams,

Born, 11 December 1860,
Baptism, 10 February, 1861, St Paul.
Ray St
Parents, John & Eliza Williams.

Most Likely,
Sarah Jane Williams, 1860, December Qtr, Liverpool, 8b 88

[Bertieone]

I think that marriage between John Williams and Eliza Jones may be the right one . Here is another baptism from Lan OPC for John and Eliza with the middle name of Watkin after her father:

Baptism: 16 Mar 1853 St Paul, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
John Watkin Williams - son of John Williams & Elliza [sic]
Abode: Kellys Place, St Pauls Square
Occupation: Porter
Baptised by: Thos. W. Jones
Register: Baptisms 1846 - 1864, Page 74, Entry 5
Source: LDS Film 1656373

Alison

Excellent find Alison,

Did John Watkin die, another John born 1859, 1861 census, Ray St.
John Williams 42
Eliza Williams 41
Eliza McDonald 16
Edward Williams 11
Robert Williams 4
John Williams 2
Sarah Jane Williams 4
Edmund Williams 43
Edward Ellis 26
David Ellis 23

[Alison C]

Looks like John Watkin Williams died in 1856:

Births Dec 1852
Williams, John Watkin
Liverpool, 8b, 80

Deaths Jun 1856
Williams, John Watkin
W Derby, 8b, 252

Alison

[Blue70]

That marriage record looks promising but we still need a birth certificate to confirm that it's the right Eliza.


Blue

[djw3]

Thanks again, all of you are amazing.
I think the marriage certificate could be correct. Eliza and John lived in St Pauls Square in 1851 and in 1861 in Ray Street. Ray Street no longer exist but I found it was in St Paul's Square bounded by Old Hall Street, Tithebarn St, Leeds Road and Vauxhall Road.
Ray St is given as Johns address in certificate. Also John's Father was Robert and was a farmer, Family living in Llanferres in 1841. And his occupation, warehouseman, matches
I did make typo with the 1851 census, 37 not 27.
Was unaware of John Watkins. Sarah died between the 61 and 71 census.
On the 1851 census Eliza is stated as being born in Penybryn. I appears to be a name of an area or a road, street or house rather than a place. Not really important. Delighted with all that has been found.
What is Lan OPC,please?
djw

[dickiesam]

On the 1851 census Eliza is stated as being born in Penybryn. I appears to be a name of an area or a road, street or house rather than a place. Not really important. Delighted with all that has been found.
What is Lan OPC,please?
djw

Eliza also says born in Anglesey and the Welsh words PenyBryn [Pen y Bryn] literally mean Head of the hill. Penybryn is quite a common place-name in Wales.
Coincidentally I live in the Irish version.... Barraglan!

Re: Lan OPC is Lancashire Online Parish Clerks... Explanation of the project is on the site.... http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/

[djw3]

I am grateful for the help everyone has provided. I'd been searching for quite a while, but unable to put things quite together but the information you all have provide has helped greatly.
I will send for one of the cerficates suggested. As soon as I receive it will let you know.
Many thanks .
djw

[djw3]

Hi all
I have the birth certificate for Edward Williams, Liverpool. Sub-district of Dale Street Liverpool. Born 27 February, 6 Court, Saint Pauls Square, Liverpool. Father John Williams, Mother, name, surname and maiden name, Eliza Williams. Late McDonald, formerly Jones. Registered 28 March 1850.

The certificate confirms the information you all provided, and has really been of help.
A thank you does not seem to be enough -- but thank you all, Blue, D/Sam Bertione and Alison, for all your time and effort .
Being able to share info through the forum like this is great.
djw