Haswell help needed

Post by **simone** » 10 Nov 2009 22:22

Hi Col

not sure we'll get 100% will we

Reckon Margaret/Peggy was the mummy and Robert Sharp the (step) daddy though.

Wonder where Carol is

bet she's jumped ship with all this

Simone x

Post by **colette** » 10 Nov 2009 22:40

Haaaaaaaaaa wouldn't be surprised i feel like throwing myself of something..

Why name him Samuel..unless he was the one who got her pregnant.. still can't picture a 9 year old getting on a ship and sailing off.

Wonder if she has a photo of him would love to see this man after all this LOL

XX

Post by **Carol1953** » 10 Nov 2009 23:09

Sorry guys been having problems with my computer in the end I had to take it back to new and then had to reinstall all my programmes what a task.

I can't believe the work you have been doing in my absence. Have we abondoned the idea of Samuel been taken in by William? and being born with a different name
Before my computer hiccup I emailed Auntie Win and she said the shipwreck and appearing to be an apprentice in Boston came from her father who was severely scolded by his wife everytime he spoke of Samuel. He said Samuel told his grandson (under 10) her Dad about his life.
The American Civil War only started in 1861 I wondered if thats when with his wife and daughter dead decided to go (father a son) the family never knew his name and Auntie Win has searched for census and birth details and drew a blank in USA. I haven't heard from her in days I hope shes alright she is a sprightly 94 year old
Carol

Post by **simone** » 10 Nov 2009 23:22

Hi Carol

Well.. if you can work it out from this thread, although you may have to read it right through... Col proved the link to the Higginson family via Mary Ann Cooper nee Higginson, from your death cert for Harriet Samuel's daughter . We know Ann Gaulton with the Higginson's was Ann Haswell, wife of Charles.

I found a marriage for Margaret Haswell in 1852 to a Robert Sharp a Ropemaker. Margaret states her father is Charles and occupations tie in. Margaret is 'Peggy' daughter of Charles and Ann Haswell, she was baptised in 1827 on same day her dad was buried, she was about 6, confirmed from census entries.

We reckon that Sam was prob son of Margaret and when married and asked who his father was he said Robert, a ropemaker, and the assumption has been that he is Robert Haswell and Samuel hasn't said he is actually Robert Sharp. Sam has prob done this to avoid embarrasment of saying he was illigitimate. By time of 2nd marriage prob not so sensitive about it.

How that makes some sense

if you read through you will see the census entries etc.

Simone x

Post by **colette** » 10 Nov 2009 23:36

Hi Carol i know PC'S can be a pain when they go wrong..

Elizabeth did not die till 1864.. so Sam had to be here up untill then at least..

He definalty belongs to these Haswell's and theres only Peggy that can be his mum really.. we have found her as a Servant in 1841 in Toxteth and 1851 West Derby..so shes on the scene.

Its looking like the stories maybe true as hes knowhere to be found in 1851..and by all accounts if mum was working he would be with Harriet.. he must have had affection for her to name a daughter after her.. and then she dies and he names another after her..but does not name one Margaret ??? he wouldnt have a passenger eecord going out but should have one coming back...

Makes you wonder why..or Robert for that matter.. so i dont think he had much to do with them.

If he did Stowaway.. maybe he was scared and changed his forename from whatever to Samuel...

Just trying to work on this son Margaret & Robert Sharp had together named David b Lpool 1856..

I have him in 1881 in Widness..

David Sharp age 24 b Lpool Foreman In Flaxmill
Ellen age 24 b Farnworth Lancs
Robert age 4 b Farnworth Lancs
Maud age 2 b Farnworth

cant see them in 1891

but 1901 Maud is aged 22 and living in Barking London some sort of assistant cant make out the first word..wondering whats shes doing down there..she could have gone visiting Samuel.. as he would be half brother to David.. if all this is correct..maybe she liked it and did not want to go back to Lancashire..

Post by **simone** » 11 Nov 2009 07:54

Hi

Samuel and Maud are only a couple of miles away from each other in 1901

all hallows barking to: mile end, london
you'll have to shift map to the right a bit to see blue route line fully, or if it doesn't show just refresh the page

Simone x

Post by **colette** » 11 Nov 2009 15:13

Hi

Cannot find the rest of Maud's family or Maud in 1891,, looking interesting that she is down in London and as you say not far from Samuel.. what if her parents died and she went to live with them..that would be the connection solved...

God i cant believe the things we do and the twists and turns and the people we unearth when doing this haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.. its like a spiders web started with Samuel and now we are onto Maud Sharp...

If she stayed down there she proberbly married down there..

xx

Post by **simone** » 11 Nov 2009 20:21

Hey Col, all we need now is for Sam or one of his children to be a witness at Maud's wedding

Simone x

Post by **colette** » 11 Nov 2009 22:01

Hiya

How are we gonna trace her shes not on the 1911, so either married or died or emigrated..we need to look through Free BMD.. discount any with middle names..as her birth reg was plain old Maud..1901-1911 time range..

David got back to me abit upset as it wasnt Sharp that was out main search but Haswell..as i said to him David would be Half brother to Samuel.. so they are all connected, and its more family so should be happy..

I have asked him what he knows about David Sharp as i cant find him after 1881 and Maud either..maybe if we look at the same address from 1881 4 Windermere St Widness..

xx

Post by **colette** » 11 Nov 2009 22:11

Hes not at 4 Windermere St in 1891.

XX

Post by **simone** » 11 Nov 2009 22:12

Hi Col

There is a marriage on Freebmd in London sep q 1901 for Maud Sharp to William Truss/ or Samuel Stephen Brown.. I've been trying to trace on the 1911 but can't see them

In 1891 the Wilde family are at 4 Windermere Street

Simone x

Post by **colette** » 11 Nov 2009 22:20

Hi

was thinking maybe Carol has some of Samuels kids marriage certs..as you say maybe Maud was witness on one..

xx

Post by **colette** » 11 Nov 2009 22:27

Hi

Just looking at all of Samuels kids.. the last one born was Eleanor Maud

1891 come on wheres the name Maud come from are you thinking what i am thinking haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

xx

Post by **simone** » 11 Nov 2009 23:07

colette wrote:
the last one born was Eleanor Maud 1891 come on wheres the name Maud come from are you thinking what i am thinking haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

xx

Most definitely Col

Case closed soon I reckon

Simone x

Post by **colette** » 11 Nov 2009 23:14

Contacted a woman on genes as she has a Maud Sharp born in London City... wanted to know who her Maud married so we can rule that marriage out..

upto abt 30 scraps of paper on Haswell haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa boomin paper everywhere..haaaaaaaa

xx

Post by **colette** » 12 Nov 2009 00:10

Ok

Found David Sharp in 1891

Horatio St Monk Wearmouth Durham
David Sharp age 35 b Lpool Rope Works
Sarah age 35 b Shoreditch London
Son John T age 15 b Farnworth
Son Robert age 3 b Stepney London

1901 6 Oxford St Sunderland
Heead Sarah Sharp age 43 b London Charwoman widow
Son Robert age 13 b London
Dau Lily age 7 b Sunderland

so Ellen has died.. and first son Robert too..now we have another Robert and a Lily

theres a marriage Mile End London David Sharp - Sarah Cheeseman

There is a Sarah M Cheeseman a servant born 1856 in All Hallows BARKING 1881 b London

if its the right marriage we know David was down in London...maybe he had nobody to look after Maud so took her to Samuel's, and met this Sarah.. then Maud didnt want to come back...

xx

xx

Post by **Hilary** » 12 Nov 2009 02:43

I think I just struck gold!

8 Jun 1884 Trinity Church in parish of Stepney
David Sharpe widower mill manager Bow father Robert Sharp deceased

Sarah Cheesman spinster 28 Bow father Robert Cheesman

witnesses
SAMUEL HASWELL
Jane Bush

Can't sleep so took to playing on the pC and it was worth it!

Ed Officer

Post by **simone** » 12 Nov 2009 07:59

wow Ed

Yay!!! fantastic !!!!!!!!! whoop de whoop!!!

the last piece of the puzzle

well done

got them Col, at last

Simone x

Post by **colette** » 12 Nov 2009 11:03

Hi Gang

I never got the messages

I am made up i knew it ..its been a hard slog and god knows how many people have been thrown into the mix, persistance pays off in the end.

So old Peggy Haswell was indeed his mother just like i said..its nice to know Sam kept intouch with David.. although i do think he fell out with his mother.. why he had to run away who knows..

best news i have had in weekssssssssssssssssssss now Carol has a whole new branch of Sharps heeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

One more snippit.. Maud was working in SEETHING LANE in 1901 Samuel Pepys lived there

no 13-14 now the Assembly rooms...

Post by **MaryA** » 12 Nov 2009 12:28

Well what a great result!! Well done everybody, especially Colette who I know has been working her little socks off on this. My head is spinning with it all, so I don't know what yours must be doing.

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