Amelia Hughes help needed

[Blue70]

There's also an Elisha & Josh Brown in a Liverpool barracks on the 1841 Census.

Blue

[Hilary]

I'm sorry it should have been 1841

Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece: 558; Book: 8; Civil Parish: Liverpool; County: Lancashire; Enumeration District: 10; Folio: 7; Page: 7; Line: 6; GSU roll: 306940.

[colette]

Hi Frank

Josh Hughes b c1826 not in County..living 42 Bixteth Street Dale Street area, lots of Mariners living with him maybe a lodging house...

Elisha Hughes b c1826 not in County living at Sidney Street near Lord Nelson Street he wa sliving with
Isabella Mackey aged 40 Not Born In County.
Elizabeth Mackey age 4 born Lancs
Elizabeth Crasburgh age 60 not born in County.

If these two boys Josh & Elisha are Amelia's siblings then its possible she wasn't born in Lancashire either...

[crossl]

Hi Colette, the only names I have for Amelia are her 3 bothers (John, Elisha and Josh) and sister Anne. Also John Brown, a bricklayer, father of her child Charlotte. I don't know why they are mentioned and her parents are not. I think I have to concentrate on other Amelias Hughes (possibly born outside of Labcashire, as you mentioned).

I don't think I should be ignoring those names, they came from her mouth so I have to treat them as being facts. Any ideas as to where to look now?

Frank

[Alison C]

Hello,

After a bit of further digging, I don't think Charlotte Amelia Hughes is the one we're after.

There's a marriage on FamilySearch for a Charlotte Hughes (no middle name mentioned) - father Richard Hughes - to Charles Warren in Liverpool in 1850. There are then 2 births to Charles and Charlotte (again on FamilySearch) - Richard 1850 and John 1857 - both in Birkenhead. Charlotte Warren is still in Birkenhead in 1881 and 1901 - still no mention of a middle name. Finally there is a death registration for her in Birkenhead in 1907 as Charlotte Amelia Warren.

So it appears that Charlotte Amelia Hughes stayed in this country and wasn't the Amelia Hughes who went to Tasmania.

Alison

[crossl]

Thanks Alison, at least we can stroke her name off. At first I thought we might of gotten lucky with her. We'll keep on digging.

Thanks, Frank

[colette]

Hi Frank

I still think she is the Amelia Brown living with John Brown in Sussex Street Toxeth..its odd thats hes 20 and shes 15..dont you think..this is why its been hard to trace an Amelia Hughes...because she using Brown..

[crossl]

Hi Colette, it's possible but why can't Amelia Brown be a sister to John Brown. If Amelia is using the Brown name then why would she switch back to Hughes in later records. Just thinking out loud.

Frank

[colette]

Hi Frank

Proberbly because they are acting like a married couple..I cannot see another Amelia who fits the bill in Liverpool really..

Its such a pity we dont have her marriage certificate..thats if she did marry William Glover..isnt there anyone in Australia who can help, do they have parish records like we do..that can be looked at.

[crossl]

I'm not quite sure where to go from here. If she was indeed born outside Lancashire are there online parish records for counties bordering it? She might have come from a neibouring county.

Colette, when you say John Brown and Amelia are acting like a married couple, what do you mean?

Frank

[colette]

Hi Frank

what I was thinking is because we cannot find Amelia in 1841 In Liverpool..maybe she was living with John Brown..so i looked at Amelia Brown's born c 1825 in Liverpool in 1841 and she was the one i found..but thinking about it the John Brown mentioned on her criminal record was a Bricklayer..this guy seemed to be some designer of sorts..

Maybe Amelia was born in Ireland and came to Liverpool alone to work c late 1841/2 so we might never find her here..The Josh & Elisha Hughes we found were not born in Lancashire..

Another thourght if Amelia was one for getting into trouble alot she maybe in an Institution under just her initials.

The person on Ancestry who has her in their tree is called P Brayne they are in New South Wales..they dont have parents names for Amelia..

[Blue70]

Amelia's descent into a criminal lifestyle appears to me to be connected to her family background. The uncertainty about her parentage and the exact nature of her relationship to John Brown on the Tasmanian record indicates to me that she came from an unstable family background. Her background may be too complicated to establish through surviving records.

Blue

[colette]

Hi Frank..just reading back through the threads so far

you said in one "I did find a Charlotte Hughes in the 1841 census who was 15 and she must have been in a home as there were about 100 other household members in that residence on HOWARD STREET. Don't know whether this Charlotte is the Chalotte Amelia Hughes born on June 26, 1826"

This Charlotte Hughes was actualy in the Borough Jail in the Howard Street District..I guess its worth keeping her in mind..

[crossl]

Hi Charlotte and Blue, she's a hard one to crack. I think I may have found her burial place in Hobart Tasmania. The cemetery is currently looking for her burial record a well as William Glover who she married in 1857. I'm hoping for some enlightening information although not holding my breath. She died in 1910 and he died in 1881.

My wife says her grandmother (who was Amelia's grandaughter) was very tight lipped and never spoke about her family. I guess in those days it was the convict stigma, although getting 7 years for stealing a pair of shoes hardly qualifies as a hardened convict. Coming from a troubled past it probably was the best thing for her to get a new start in Tasmania. One of her daughters did marry Sir Henry Hughes who had 15000 employees at the IXL Jam Factory in Hobart.

William Glover was born in Manchester in 1820 and was an officer of the marine board of Hobart. Looks like her life got better when she was freed.
I have not found when he left England for Tasmania. Was he a convict? His parents were Henry and Jane Glover of Manchester.

Frank

[colette]

Hi

I thourght i had put Amelia & Williams burials on here..but looking through the posts i mustn't have

Comelian Bay Cem

Church Of England Burial Amelia Glover age 87 buried 16th Sept 1910 Section Y Grave 51

Church Of England Burial William Glover age 60 buried 24th July 1881 Section Y Grave 51

both last residence Hobart....

[crossl]

Those are the ones I found Colette. Awaiting a reply from Cornelian Bay Cemetery.

Frank

[Blue70]

Amelia is described as having a dark complexion could she have been black or mixed race? There's a John Brown who was born in Demerara (Guyana) he was sentenced to 10 years transportation in Liverpool in 1844 for housebreaking and stealing. If we assume the reference to John Brown was as father of Amelia's child it would make sense that her partner would also be involved in crime.

This John Brown was 24 years old in 1844. He had a father called John Brown and a brother called Francis Brown in Liverpool. Occupation was Labourer and Striker. The Tasmanian records don't record race but they do describe this John Brown as having a black complexion and Amelia having a dark complexion. This John Brown had a tattoo of letters on his left arm near his wrist. Looks like FH.


Blue

[crossl]

I haven't heard of any colour references in the family research although it could be as you say. A possibility, but does it say he's a bricklayer?

Frank

[Blue70]

This John Brown was recorded on his criminal records as a Labourer and Striker. The colour reference may not have been mentioned in the family if Amelia was white and John Brown was black. Amelia probably had one child with John Brown in Liverpool who later died and she probably had no more to do with him. It looks like this John Brown ended up in some sort of militia in Tasmania/Australia. This is only a theory one of many possibilities for the identification of John Brown.


Blue

[colette]

After looking again at the Tasmania convict records for Amelia ..it does say her native Place is Liverpool..plus she had been in trouble a few time..stealing boots she got 2 months ..stealing a shawl she got 1 month being disorderly she got two weeks and two weeks for fighting

Alice Jones was sent to Van Diemans Land on board the Woodbridge she also says her native place was Liverpool, her fathers name is so hard to read but looks like Rud ???? she had a sister Charlotte sister Elizabeth and brother William..

these two girl must have lived near each other to know each other...Note Amelia did not give any parents names maybe because they were both dead..no guidence this is why she fell into trouble.

Any news on a marriage yet ??????????????



xx