NOEL JAMES BROWN, RAILWAYMAN, VIVIAN POTTS, BLANCHE BARLOW

[grimpil]

I am very intersted in Noel James Brown who worked on the railway in Liverpool in the 1920s and early 1930s. His father was Walter Brown, a journalist. Noel married Mary MacSweeney, and later Blanche Potts. They lived at 126 Ritson street. I have reason to believe Noel may have been my grandfather. He died in 1933.
BLANCHE BROWN (neePOTTS) later married GEORGE BARLOW. Both are buried in West Derby Cemetery. They lived at Huyton. Blanche had a son VIVIAN POTTS b.1927 (later known as John). Vivian spent some time in Fazzakerley Cottage homes, admitted in 1937, and later at Shaw Street home for boys. He had the distinguising feature of a 'hare-lip' which was surgiaclly repaired, possibly around that time. (He was my Dad)
Does anybody have any information or recollection of any of these people? I would be eternally grateful for any info however small.
Years of research has helped to form a picture but there are many gaps.

[MaryA]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

It's not clear from your post whether you are looking for living descendants of the family or researching backwards. If you want to come forward we have put together a few suggestions here .

The records for the schools you mention will be held at the Record Office, although possible in document form so may well be at the satellite facility at Sandhills, information about this here

There may well be a 100 year closure on the records, however if you were able to provide proof of your next of kinship and that the person was deceased, there may be a flexibility about whether they will allow you access. If you wish to follow this through, although you may well have already done so, it would be best to contact them first to check the availability. http://liverpool.gov.uk/libraries-and-a ... y-history/

[dickiesam]

Hi and welcome!
From NOEL JAMES BROWN's death registration he was born abt 1886. Are you aware of any siblings? And since his first marriage lasted more than a couple of years, are you aware of any children from that marriage?

Marriage Dec 1931 - Burton - 6b - 859: Brown, Noel J and Potts, Blanche.
Death Dec 1933: Brown, Noel J - 47 - W. Derby - 8b - 503.

Couldn't find Noel's first marriage until I found the Index says he actually married a Margaret V..
Name: BROWN, Noel James and MCSWEENEY, Margaret V
Registration District: Liverpool.
Year/qtr of Registration: 1908 / Oct-Nov-Dec
Volume No: 8B; Page No: 220;

DS

EDITED TO ADD First marriage info.

[dickiesam]

Re my earlier post...
Unless there was a child born between April 1911 and September 1911 it would seem probable that the only child born to the Brown/McSweeney marriage was this one:
Births Jun 1912: Brown, Mary - McSweeney - Toxteth P. - 8b - 357.

I think you may need to check the Ancestry 1911 Census for a Noel and Margaret Brown [bn 1886 in the IoM and 1882 in Ireland, respectively], at 82 Upper Stanhope Street.

If the IoM birthplace is confirmed, Noel is here with parents and 3 siblings in 1891..
RG12 - Piece:4689 - Folio:71 - Page:2.
Address: 18 Alexander Drive, Brunswick Road, Conchan, Douglas, Isle of Man.
In 1901, he is still at home working as a clerk..
RG13 - Piece:5304 - Folio:71 - Page:29.

DS

[grimpil]

Dear Mary and Dickiesam,

I am amazed at the speed of your responses and of your willingness to help. I will follow up the links and information that you have provided as soon as I can.
The people mentioned are of course all deceased, but I am hopeful one day of being able to trace some living kin. I know that I must not do this using this forum and appreciate the reasons why, but if I can get a few clues as to the wider deceased family, then I can do the foward tracing work myself anyway.
Until last year I had not known a single relative of my Dad (deceased in 2004), but have now managed to contact relatives of Blanche who have steered me in this direction.
On the admission document when Vivian was admitted to Fazzakerley Cottage home, there is an address for his Mother, but then a note which says 'per hospital'. What might this mean?
I have traced Blanche's line back to about 1612 in Broseley, Shropshire.

Many, many thanks.

[MaryA]

On the admission document when Vivian was admitted to Fazzakerley Cottage home, there is an address for his Mother, but then a note which says 'per hospital'. What might this mean?

Good luck with your search for some living relatives, I hope you make some contacts.

There's a nice site about the Fazakerley Cottages Homes that you might like to see, not a huge amount on Fazakerley itself but it does have a couple of links to other blogs and sites.

As for the note "per hospital" I can only think that perhaps the mother was ill and in hospital so although the address given was for her home, she may not have been there and of course this could well have been the reason for his admission.

[grimpil]

Thank-you Mary A,

I have looked at that site before and posted a message on it, but no response as yet. I have now found Noel Brown and his first wife on the 1911 census and on other IoM censuses. It wasn't helpful that he was transcribed as Moel on one census and Hazel on the other, but we persevere!

The address of the hospital was 120 Upper Warwick Street. Any idea what sort of hospital this is or was?
We have always found it odd that his mother let him go to a children's home when he was 10 years old, although she had been widowed for 4 years by then. People who we have found who knew her said that she was very kindly and loved children. An illness would explain a lot. She never recovered him and he made his own way in the world, completely blocking out his family.

thanks for your help.

[MaryA]

Googling found a good result - http://www.nursingnetuk.com/employerdetails/119

"The Women’s Hospital

The original Lying-In Hospital treated all aspects of women’s health, but, gradually, medical opinion turned against mixing maternity patients with other operative cases due to the risk of infection. A committee started raising funds for a separate, non-maternity establishment, and in 1883 the Special Hospital for Women opened in Shaw Street.

Interest in specialist treatment for women was clearly growing in Liverpool at the turn of the twentieth century. Yet another such hospital, the Samaritan, opened in Upper Warwick Street in 1895, and moved to Upper Parliament Street in 1900.

Once again, as both hospitals developed it became clear that amalgamation would mean greater efficiency. In due course the two became one: the Liverpool and Samaritan Hospital for Women, later re-titled the Women’s Hospital. The Duchess of York opened the new building in Catharine Street in 1932."

Due to your comment about her having been widowed for a few years, it was probably not problems in pregnancy, but may have been any of a number of "female complaints", which you aren't going to know without obtaining the death certificate.

It would seem almost certain that she was not able to look after the little one herself at that time.

[grimpil]

Hmmn... that's very interesting Mary A. I had thought that she might have had a mental breakdown or similar, but this information doesn't really point to that exactly. I don't think we have her death certificate yet, but she was obviously discharged and went on to marry again when in her 50s and live a normal life. She died aged 64 in 1961.

Thank-you once again for your interest and help with this. If you ever need any assistance with resarch this side of the country (Boston, Lincs) you only have to ask.