ELIZABETH CHISNALL/JAMES ROBERTS STATION ROAD ST.HELENS

[Droberts]

Hello Everyone

I am currently tracing my Family tree and upon receiving my Grandfathers Service records (WW2) i found out he was married before and had kids its safe to say it was a shock however now i am trying to trace my family Tree on the Roberts side however details regarding the Chisnall family are surely welcome here are the details:

Elizabeth Chisnall and James Roberts married 31/12/1938 on the marriage certificate the witness was Willian G chisnall (Elizabeth Brother) and someone else names Bridget Mcginn however i have no idea who she is.

Also James (grandfather) lived 36 station road at the time of the wedding and Elizabeth was living at 26 parr Avenue Haydock.James father was Named Isaac he was a coal miner and also my grandfather at the time was also a coal miner.

My grandfather had a daughter named Sheila and on his service record another named Alfred however I cannot find his birth certificate so this could have been his middle name maybe if he was named after my grandfather (james)

I dont know anything about my grandfather before the war or his other family but i really want to find out more and hope his daughter or son are still alive as my father has half brother and sister he has never known.

Any information anyone can provide would be brilliant

Thanks

D roberts

[Tina]

Hi D.R
It never ceases to amaze what turns up in family trees.
Welcome to the forum

I found some Roberts/Chisnall births in St H.
Interesting 2 were before the marriage in 1938.
Looked in Lancs BMD marriages, there was another marriage in 1934 of Gladys Chisnall to Leslie Roberts, St Thomas in Eccleston.
Perhaps 2 sisters married 2 brothers?

Ill send the birth details for Sheila, and one or two other brothers, maiden Chisnall, in a private messge as they may still be alive.

Tina

[MaryA]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

Thanks to Tina for being discreet about possible living people. We are often asked about tracing forwards, we have tried to put together a couple of suggestions here http://liverpool-genealogy.org.uk/phpBB ... php?t=8154 I hope they help.

[dickiesam]

Between 1938 and 1955 there were 7 Roberts nee Chisnall births in Lancashire. 4 in St Helens, 1938 to 1942; 1 in Newton le Willows 1946 and 2 in Liverpool South 1953 and 1955.

Had a look further back and found another one in St Helens in 1935 and one in West Derby 1932.

Details of the above are in a PM.

Dickiesam

[Tina]

Great wombating D.S

Tina

[MaryA]

I hope droberts comes back to the forum to receive your messages.

[Tina]

Hi Mary
Had a pm today.
James born 1917c cannot find his birth, father Isaac.

Tina

[dickiesam]

Hi peeps,
There are 18 James Roberts births in 1917 in Lancashire.

Several have a second forename that, on current information, we could rule out. I have listed the Liverpool registration districts which shows only 3 candidates. If we had the father Isaac's occupation, and any older siblings of James [by 7 or 8 years or more], we might be able to pinpoint a possible district from the unmentionable census.

All 1917!
ROBERTS, James H B - Toxteth Park - Mar qtr. [m/n Greaves]
ROBERTS, James - West Derby - Jun qtr. [m/n Warburton]
ROBERTS, James - West Derby - Jun qtr. [m/n Wilkinson]
ROBERTS, James S - West Derby - Jun qtr. [m/n Haskell]
ROBERTS, James - Toxteth Park - Sep qtr. [m/n Carthy]
ROBERTS, James A - Liverpool - Sep qtr. [m/n Eglin]

DS

PS: Full GRO Index References on request.

EDITED TO INCLUDE MAIDEN NAMES!

[MaryA]

I'm a little confused, I have used +/- five years around 1917 searching the births of Roberts, in each case using the mother's maiden name from the LancsBMD marriage list of Isaac Roberts and haven't found a James with father Isaac Roberts. (Marriages going back to 1899)

[dickiesam]

Mary, could you post the maiden name of the marriage you found in case I missed it?

I searched for Isaac Roberts marriages in Liverpool 1880 to 1900 and found 6. And like you, I couldn't match any of the 11 possible maiden names with the 1917 births. If the YoB was calculated from another document, such as a marriage cert, it could be off.

Incidentally, in the unmentionable, for births between 1875 and 1900 there's only one Isaac Roberts, occupation coal miner. Born abt 1887, he married Margaret Ann Done - Salford - 8d - 214 -Jun 1910. Couldn't find any children. Couple were living with his in-laws in Pendleton.

DS

[dickiesam]

Just finished banging my head off the desk!
I was looking at Liverpool for his birth when it is probable I should have been looking at the St Helens area and environs..

So did a search for James Roberts births regd in Prescot, Warrington, Wigan, Leigh, Salford, and Barton upon Irwell. Found 15 between 1916 and 1918.

Got 15 maiden names: Riley; Chadwick; Davies; Woodward; Tilley; Shatwell; Clancy; Dobson; Nelson; Berry; Wragg; Fairbrother; Owen; Crabtree and James.

Haven't found a match for an Isaac Roberts marriage yet! So did he marry?

DS

[Hilary]

On my father's 2nd World War Army Records it gives his date of birth and place of birth (town). Is James' full date of borth and place of birth not given on the records.

Or if not when did he die? As maybe that gives his date of birth.

Hilary
Ed Officer

[MaryA]

Just finished banging my head off the desk!

We don't know if he was eldest child, middling or youngest so can't really figure out when his parents may have married but between 1900 and 1917 Lancs BMD has 9 Isaac marriages -

Bartlett, Parry, Hunt, Hall/Schofield, Dunstan, Morris, Done, Kirkham and Snape, which was in Bedford Methodist in Leigh in 1915 and that's the one I might have opted for but of course we can't really just speculate without any other evidence.

Hilary's query is the best one so far, await further information from droberts.

[simone]

Got 15 maiden names: Riley; Chadwick; Davies; Woodward; Tilley; Shatwell; Clancy; Dobson; Nelson; Berry; Wragg; Fairbrother; Owen; Crabtree and James.

Haven't found a match for an Isaac Roberts marriage yet! So did he marry?

DS

not sure but

Marriages Dec 1901
COCKER Thomas Prescot 8b 1142
Jones Sarah Ellen Prescot 8b 1142
Roberts Isaac Prescot 8b 1142
TILLEY Ann Jane Prescot 8B 1142


birth Jun q 1917
Roberts James Tilley Warrington 8c 267

not sure about the Warrington thing though would/could that be right

possibles 1901
at 14 Cook St Whiston
RG13; Piece: 3516; Folio: 82; Page: 22.
Moses Roberts 53 b Mostyn Coal Miner
Louisa Roberts 54
John Lewis Roberts 26
Isaac Roberts 24 coal miner b Mostyn Flintshire
Moses Roberts 9
David Roberts 11

1901
RG13; Piece: 3527; Folio: 60; Page: 60
93 Elephant Lane
William Leach 34
Louisa Leach 28
Samuel Leach 6
William Leach 2
Joseph Leach 6 Months
Ann Jane Tilley 21 sister in law b St Helens, labourer at Brickworks

Simone x