Mary Ann Masterson 1871 census.

Post by **moya** » 03 Jan 2011 08:40

Mary Ann was the godmother of Ellen Masterson, baptised April 1868 at St Vincent de Paul Church, James St, Liverpool. I do not know if this was her married or single name. Either way she was the sister or sister-in-law of my great grandfather James Masterson. If anyone has access to the 1871 census could they please check to see if she is recorded. Thankyou. Moya

Post by **MaryA** » 03 Jan 2011 09:54

Presumably you know the date of birth of James to give us a bit of help? and who were Ellen's parents? and please give the reference for the 1871 census that you have them on, the only one I find in either 1871 or 1881 is Mary Ellen, born approx 1867 daughter to Walter and Elizabeth

Post by **moya** » 03 Jan 2011 10:39

Hello MaryA. I do not have any reference for Mary Ann Masterson on the 1871 census. The child Ellen Masterson was born to James & Bridget Masterson in 1868, the baptismal record shows that Mary Ann Masterson was the godmother. I would presume that Mary Ann would have been an adult in order to be a godmother so she may possibly have been born circa 1848. I am trying to find the relationship between Mary Ann and James who was born circa 1844 in Ireland. If she can be located on the 1871 census it would be a start. The child Ellen was born at 57 Simpson Street Liverpool on the 14th April 1968, but her birth was not registered until the 17th August, the birth date on the certificate being 6th July 1868 (presumably to avoid the penalty of not registering the birth within the required 6 weeks). At the time of the registration Bridget's address was Seacombe, Cheshire.

Post by **MaryA** » 03 Jan 2011 11:32

It was the details of Ellen and parents in the 1871 census that I was after to try to give some clues to begin searching for Mary Ann.

1871
Spring Terrace, Union Street, Stourbridge, Worcestershire
James Masterson Head M 26 Tailor Ireland
Bridget Wife M 21 Ireland
John son 4 Scholar Stafford Brierly Hill
Ellen daur 2 Lancaster Liverpool
Thomas son 1 Worcester Stourbridge
RG10; Piece: 3022; Folio: 96; Page: 9

Judging by the way the family have moved around Mary Ann could be anywhere

Post by **MaryA** » 03 Jan 2011 11:48

She could even have been his mother, not unknown to have a grandparent to be a godparent also.

The only possibility I have found so far is a marriage between a Mary Ann Masterson and an Edward Ford in Q3 1869 Salford (Register Office or Registrar Attended), which makes me think maybe an RC marriage so worth looking at her birthplace.

1871
22 House, Borough Street, Pendleton, Lancashire
Edward Ford Head M 40 Carter London
Mary Ann Wife M 38 Cotton Reeler Ireland
Margaret daur 6 months Pendleton Lancashire
Mary Bolber Sister M 75 Annuitant Ireland
RG10; Piece: 4009; Folio: 159; Page: 24

Post by **dickiesam** » 03 Jan 2011 12:31

In 1861 the only Irish-born [abt 1833, +/- 5 years!], and unmarried, Mary (Ann) Masterson [or variation] that I could turn up is this one:

MASTERTON, Mary Ann - Dtr - U/m - 24 - 1837 - Fork Burnisher - Longport [probably Longford], Ireland.
Address: 10 Cotton Mill Walk, Sheffield, Yorkshire (West Riding).
RG09 / Piece:3481 / Folio:77 / Page:21. 1

If the above isn't her I reckon she didn't arrive in England until after the census.

With reference to MaryA's 1871 Stourbridge find, this is probably the marriage...
Marriages Sep 1865: Filbers, Bridget to Masterson, James - Stourbridge - 6c - 292.
According to her census age she was only 15!

Dickiesam

Post by **moya** » 03 Jan 2011 14:24

Thankyou all for your help, I knew it would be a longshot that Mary Ann would be on the 1871 census. James and Bridget Masterson came from County Mayo and were married in Stourbridge in 1865. Of all their children only Ellen was born in Liverpool and it is impossible to find out why they were there at the time of her birth, as they were back in Stourbridge for the 1871 census. After the death of James in 1889, the family emigrated to USA (except my grandfather who stayed in England). One of the daughters travelled prior to the rest of the family and she shipped out of Liverpool nominating Warrington as her last address, which indicates to me that there were relatives in the Liverpool area that she probably stayed with. I was hoping that research would show a connection between James and Mary Ann, but I guess it's going to be too hard. Regards to all. Moya

Post by **MaryA** » 03 Jan 2011 14:37

That could be a link between the Mary Ann that Dickiesam found above -

1891 - 8 Percivals Fold, Warrington
James Gleeson, a Navvy from Galway and his wife and children all from Warrington have lodgers, mainly from Ireland including
John Masterson S 45 Iron Pudler from Ireland Longford
RG12; Piece: 3074; Folio 146; Page 32

Post by **dickiesam** » 03 Jan 2011 15:28

Hello Moya,
Re:

but I guess it's going to be too hard.

Don't underestimate the crew on this forum. There are many, like me, who are infected with the dog-with-a-bone syndrome.

I assume you have documentary evidence that James and Bridget came from Mayo and it's not based on family lore or hearsay? It is a big stretch of the imagination to change the Longport I thought was probably Longford to actually be Westport?

There is an old Irish word Longphort which means a Viking enclosure or fort usually on the bank of a river where a longboat could be brought in. But I haven't come across a Longport as a village or hamlet.

Dickiesam

Post by **moya** » 04 Jan 2011 06:37

Hello Dickiesam. James Masterson came from Ballycroy, Claggan Co. Mayo. Bridget came from Westport Co. Mayo. I got this from the 1881 census. I have completed my research into this side of the family,(although I lost track of some of them in USA) it was just that Mary Ann kept bugging me, wondering who she was and why she was godmother to James & Bridget's daughter Ellen. I did find one Mary Ann on the 1881 census married to a Michael Masterson, and this might relate to a marriage in 1864 (found on FreeBMD). Michael came from Ireland but name of town not recorded, so I don't know whether to send for the marriage certificate or not. But if they were on the 1881, why can't they be found on the 1871. Regards Moya

Post by **MaryA** » 04 Jan 2011 09:30

Well strangely I suspect that you think Michael Masterson married the Mary Ann Ferns who was in the list on FreeBMD, but I believe I have tracked down the marriage on the Liverpool History Projects site which gives

Michael Masterson to Mary Ann Smith at St Vincent De Paul

The actual GRO ref for Michael has been mistranscribed and the reference for them both should be Q3 1864 8b 489 not 484.

If anybody is able to do you a look up for the St Vincent de Paul Register that will be the cheapest way, alternatively the pricing is a lot cheaper on this site http://www.liverpoolhistoryprojects.co.uk

Post by **simone** » 04 Jan 2011 10:53

There is a death for a Michael Masterson in Jun q 1864.

A possible marraiage for Mary Masterson in 1870 at St Nick's to James Roe.

Obviously no idea if any of this relevant, but just a thought that Michael may have died pre 1871 and Mary remarried

However, this is probabaly james Roe and mary in 1871, living with the Munroe family,
RG10; Piece: 3776; Folio: 9; Page: 10.
Name Age
James Roe 30 b Liverpool, Porter
Mary Roe 24 b Liverpool

might be worth a look at the marriage though to see who Mary's parents were

Simone x

Post by **MaryA** » 04 Jan 2011 11:01

I don't think they are this family Simone, in 1881 they are at
1 House 3 Court Brindley Street, Toxteth Park
Michael Masterson Head M 48 Rigger Ireland
Mary Ann Wife M 35 Lancashire Liverpool
James Son Unm 15
Mary Ann daur 13
RG11; Piece: 3634; Folio: 41; Page: 36

There are no dittoes for James and young Mary Ann, so it can only be assumed that they were born in Liverpool, but since the others moved about a bit, perhaps these did also.

Post by **simone** » 04 Jan 2011 11:10

Throwing this one in the mix 'cos James was a Tailor and this chap is a Cloth dealer

1851 census, Livesley Place, Shaw's Brow, Liverpool
HO107; Piece: 2185; Folio: 50; Page: 21
John F Masterson 20 b Ireland, Cloth dealer
Mary A Masterson 23 b Liverpool

1861
RG9; Piece: 2665; Folio: 33; Page: 3
John Masterson 30 cloth/ clothes? broker
Mary A Masterson 31 William Masterson 7
Mary J Masterson 5
Margaret Masterson 2

by 1871 Mary Ann has died, so perhaps that is why you can't find out who she is from that census

1871
RG10; Piece: 3774; Folio: 7; Page: 6
John Masterson 40 dealer, widow, Ireland Dublin
William Masterson 18
Mary Jane Masterson 16
Francis Masterson 9
Michel Masterson 42 brother b Dublin

1881

John remarried

RG11; Piece: 3654; Folio: 97; Page: 9
John Masterson 46 Tailor/ cLothes dealer
Margaret Masterson 34
John Masterson 1

poss marriage lancs bmd
1875
MASTERSON John F CAROLAN Margaret Liverpool, Register Office or Registrar Attended Liverpool

by 1891 Margaret, a clothes dealer in workhouse
RG12; Piece: 2917; Folio 113; Page 26
still married though, no sign of John

Simone x

Post by **simone** » 04 Jan 2011 12:43

maybe not then

Deaths Sep 1867
Masterson Mary 34 Liverpool 8b 179

Deaths Dec 1867
Masterson Mary Ann 40 Liverpool 8b 103

Post by **dickiesam** » 04 Jan 2011 13:48

Hi Moya,
Trying to find out where in Ireland he came from, I found that Michael Masterson, bn Ireland abt 1833, in the 1881 with wife Mary Ann bn abt 1846, no problem.

Then went looking for him in 1891. Couldn't see him so assumed he had died. Then looked for Mary Ann.....

1891>
MASTERSON, Mary Anne - Prisoner - Widow - 45 - 1846 - Liverpool.
Address: Her Majestys Prison, Walton, Liverpool.
RG number: RG12 / Piece:2981 / Folio:91 / Page:7.

What did she do?

Dickiesam

Post by **MaryA** » 04 Jan 2011 14:07

Liverpool Mercury etc (Liverpool, England), Thursday, December 8, 1887
BEFORE MR J PATTERSON AND DR GEK
Exposing Goods at Shop Doors - Mary Masterson, 45 years of age was charged by George W Toll with stealing shirting valued at 19s. The complainant is a draper at 102 Park Road and about 5 o'clock on the 5th inst. at roll of wincey shirting was stolen from the door of his shopand the same day the prisoner pledged about eight yards for 2s. The remainder of the material was found in her possession by Detective Baxter, who had the case in hand. Mr Patterson questioned the complainant minutely as to how the goods were displayed at the shop door, Toll saying that the shirting was partly in the shop and partly outside and was fixed with string. Mr Patterson said that he thought the complainant did a great deal to provoke crime of this sort. A Grand Jury of which he (Mr Patterson) was a member, made a presentment to the Recorder that was most improper to expose goods in this way without proper protection and in future his Honour said that he would not give costs to Prosecutors who improperly exposed goods at shop doors.
Prisoner - Poverty made me take it
Detective Baxter - The prisoner was drunk when I arrested her
Mr Patterson - Drink is a qualification for crime, but I do not know whether it is any mitigation. The prisoner was sentenced to three months imprisonment, during which time Mr Patterson said she would have an opportunity of practising strict temperance
Prisoner - I will thank your Worship for a situation when I come out.

There are a couple of other entries ....

Post by **MaryA** » 04 Jan 2011 14:12

She seems to have made a habit of this

CITY SESSIONS .
Liverpool Mercury etc (Liverpool, England), Wednesday, June 3, 1891; Issue 13543.
SENTENCES
Mary Ann Masterson, 45, no occupation, stealing on the 27th April, 35 yards of print, the property of George Ryde, one month.

and
LIVERPOOL-CITY SESSIONS .
Liverpool Mercury etc (Liverpool, England), Friday, May 20, 1892; Issue 13845.
SENTENCES
Mary Ann Masterson, 45, no occupation, five weeks imprisonment for having maliciously broken a window in the property of the trustees of the late John Pentony causing damage to the extent of £50.

Post by **dickiesam** » 04 Jan 2011 15:32

That's a fair record to have at her age.. But she could have faired far worse not many years earlier. I know of an 11 year girl being sent to Australia for stealing part of a loaf of bread and another for taking a shirt from a washing line.

I wonder if this Mary Ann is the godmother Moya is looking for?

Dickiesam

Post by **moya** » 05 Jan 2011 01:23

Thankyou all for your suggestions. I have sent for the details of the marriage at St.Vincent de Paul of Michael Masterson & Mary Ann Smith, which. as you say is a bit cheaper than the GRO so hopefully I might get some info from the witness details. I couldn't find any details for the marriage of Mary Ann Ferns on the Catholic register so I don't think she is the one. Thanks MaryA for the correct page number. Will keep you informed. Regards Moya