Help with a death certificate

Post by **BarbaraH** » 28 Aug 2010 15:04

I have a Henry Torrens Kenny who died 26 July 1874 at Bankfield Rd, (Tuebrook?) West Derby. The "informant" name is not a family surname - presume if it were he were a doctor, it would state Dr xxx.
The name is A. McComb (or McCombs) - is it possible to check if McComb were a medic in the area?
Many thanks in advance
Barbara

Post by **Hilary** » 28 Aug 2010 16:09

It's quite possible that the informant was someone else in the house, or a friend, a neighbour or a more distant relative.

Hilary
Ed Officer

Post by **BarbaraH** » 28 Aug 2010 16:47

Hilary, thankyou for your response. Believe he was staying with his brother at the time (a Robert Kenny) - as Henry was the Rector of Banningham in Norfolk.

Many thanks
Barbara

Post by **Glenys** » 28 Aug 2010 17:34

The 'rough' order of priority of who can register a death are as follows:
1. Relative (usually one present at the death)
2. Person present at the death
3. 'Occupier' of the place where the death occupied (sometimes Workhouse Matron or Administration of Hospital or Care Home)
4. Person organising the funeral (not the undertaker but the person instructing the undertaker)

A doctor who attended the person during their last illness would not register the death.

If the death is reported to the Coroner and an inquest is held - no one actually signs the register. The Coroner sends a Certificate to the Registrar who then enters the details in the register.

Post by **Daisycakes** » 28 Aug 2010 21:09

Hi....I wonder does this apply to birth certs as well...as I have a cert in which the occupier of the house registered the baby((my grandfather)) and as far as I could tell he was not related....

Regards Ann

Post by **dickiesam** » 29 Aug 2010 13:44

Hi Barbara,
Searching the 1871 census [Lancashire] for A* McComb [+ variations] there are very few born between 1800 and 1855; mainly women but none shown in Bankfield Road.

Grasping straws now....
There's a nurse, Annie McComb in the Lancs 1881, bn 1847: RG11 / 3721 / 81 / 2, but I can't find her in 1871 and don't know if she was a 'proper' nurse or a children's nurse in the household in 1881.

What was brother Robert's occupation and age, and why didn't he register the death I wonder?

Is there more than one address on that death cert? I am looking at an 1877 cert where Column 1 = When and where died and Column 7 = Signature, description, & residence of informant.

Dickiesam

Post by **BarbaraH** » 30 Aug 2010 16:02

Glenys and Dickiesam - many thanks for your input.
Robert was born Ireland c1814. He married in Norfolk but by 1861 was in Liverpool area (census - under Keaney) - "Land Proprietor".
In 71 census at Holly House, Bankfield Rd - as Cattle Salesmaster. Not sure when he died but we have c 1875. Strange he didnt register the death.
You asked re Column 1 and 7 - both the same - ie Bankfield Road, W Derby.

Many thanks for all your help.
Barbara

Post by **dickiesam** » 30 Aug 2010 21:08

Hi Barbara,
I'm having difficulty locating Robert in 1861 and 1871, probably due to a transcription error. So could you post the census reference for the pages where you found him?

Dickiesam

Post by **BarbaraH** » 31 Aug 2010 14:10

Hi Dickiesam.
Right for the 1861 census, found him via his wife Harriet
RG9 P 2735 F9 p13. She's down as Harrett Keaney.
Did a street search for 1871 - that came up with them - at RG10 P3848 F76 P35 - at The Brook, Bankfield Rd, W Derby.
Hope this helps.
All the best
Barbara

Post by **dickiesam** » 31 Aug 2010 14:49

Hi Barbara,
Thanks for the references. No wonder I couldn't find Robert!
Transcribed as Reaney and Reeney [corrections sent in]. Didn't find Robert or Harriet in 1881 but did find the son Arthur Thomas Kenny. He married Alice Emily M Woodroofe Sep qtr 1880 [Liverpool - 8b- 371]. Census ref: RG11 / 3712 / 109 / 11. Incidentally, the address in 1871 is Holly House, Bankfield Road, Tuebrook, West Derby.

But, still no nearer identifying A McComb. Are you sure the initial is an A?

Dickiesam

Post by **BarbaraH** » 31 Aug 2010 16:33

Dickiesam - thanks for that. Coincidentally, the marriage cert for Arthur & Alice arrived today! Im now awaiting the death cert for Arthur who died 1883 - he's then at 31 Chester Rd, Tuebrook. And now cant find Alice after the '81 census.

As to the death cert for HT Kenny, Im going to assume that A McComb was indeed a nurse! Makes sense if he was staying at his brother's and had his illness for 3 weeks. It is definitely a A. though.

Many thanks
Barbara

Post by **dickiesam** » 31 Aug 2010 18:37

Hi Barbara,
Re Alice after 1883, when Arthur died...
Found a possible in 1891 married [in 1888] to a Francis Schrader in Toxteth Park, but she is shown as from Liverpool not Ireland.

Then I thought of a young Irish widow, only married a couple of years.... what would she do? Head home perhaps? So looked across the Irish Sea... and on http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsea ... tml#p=home found a Dec qtr 1885 marriage of an Alice Emily Matilda Kenny. I know she had the name Emily, so on her marriage cert to Arthur does she have the middle name Matilda as well? If she does this might be a huge coincidence..

Alice Emily Matilda Kenny.
Dec qtr 1885 - Dublin South
Film # 101255
Volume # 2
Page # 529
Digital Folder # 4179726
Image # 00130.

Dickiesam

Post by **BarbaraH** » 01 Sep 2010 12:41

Dickiesam - many thanks for this - she must be the one. On the marriage cert I have she is Alice Emily Matilda (Woodroofe).

Have tried the link you gave without success. Also tried going to Familysearch but it came up with nothing. What am I doing wrong?!
I searched for A E M Kenny - marriage - date 1885 - Ireland - with 0 results.

Many thanks for any additional help on tracking it down myself!

Barbara

Post by **Glenys** » 03 Sep 2010 10:04

The informants order of priority for a Birth Certificate is slightly different.

1. Mother
2. Father (if married to the mother)
3. Mother and Father (if father's details are to be included and the parents are not married)
4. Person present at the birth - if neither of above able to register
5. Person who found child
6. Person in charge of child - again if parents not available.

The last three cases are very unusual cases.

Post by **BarbaraH** » 03 Sep 2010 11:09

Thankyou for that Glenys.
Trust Ann who posted the query sees your response too.
It may prove useful in future for me too

Barbara

Post by **dickiesam** » 03 Sep 2010 13:10

Hi Barbara,
Re finding Alice's marriage in 1885..

Go to the linked site; enter Alice Kenny; select Marriages; enter 1885; make sure you enter and click on just 'Ireland' in Location because there will be a pop-up window with options like 'Ireland, Ireland', 'Ireland, United Kingdom', 'Ireland, Matabeleland', etc.

Alice Emily Matilda Kenny will be at the top of the list of hits. Click on her name for the Registry details.

Dickiesam

Post by **BarbaraH** » 03 Sep 2010 13:59

Dickiesam, many thanks for that.
Will go and find it now!

Thanks - Barbara

Post by **Daisycakes** » 05 Sep 2010 14:22

Glenys wrote:The informants order of priority for a Birth Certificate is slightly different.

1. Mother
2. Father (if married to the mother)
3. Mother and Father (if father's details are to be included and the parents are not married)
4. Person present at the birth - if neither of above able to register
5. Person who found child
6. Person in charge of child - again if parents not available.

The last three cases are very unusual cases.

Thanks Glenys...Its possible one of the last three may apply to one of my ancesters...the plot thickens!!!

Ann

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