Edward Watts - looking for information

[jgharris]

I am looking for information about my great-uncle, Edward Watts. He was born in 1889 or 1890 and in the 1901 census was living at 161 Edge Lane, Liverpool. His father was John Watts and one of his sisters, Gwladys was my grandmother.

He may have become an accountant in London but I am not sure. There is a family tree posted at

http://www3.sympatico.ca/jgharris/Watts.pdf

Any information about other family members such as his cousin Fred who I visited in London around 1958 would also be appreciated.

This is a great web-site
John Harris

[simone]

Hi John, welcome aboard

I'm a bit confused you say 161 Edge Lane in 1901, but I think they are at 4 Edge Lane

RG13; Piece: 3495; Folio: 110; Page: 18

John Watts 37 commerciall traveller- b Hants, Wellingborough
Elizabeth Watts 36 b
Edward A Watts 11
Gwladys L Watts 9
Elsie M Watts 8
Margaret J Watts 6
Gertrude M Watts 11 niece

wife and children and neice all born Liverpool.

1891 at 23 Cotswold Street

RG12; Piece: 2993; Folio 53; Page 51
John Watts 28 shoe 7 Leathere dealer, b Wellingborough
Elizabeth Watts 27
Edward A Watts 1
Rosetta Cowen 17 servant
Tom Trickett 23 servant


now there is a possible marriage for Edward A Watts in 1914 on Lancs BMD site , to a Lydia Lawrenson

WATTS Edward A LAWRENSON Lydia West Derby, Register Office or Registrar Attended Liverpool REG_WD/296/135

GRO ref Mar q 1914 vol 8b page 747

unfortinately as registrar attended we won't know the church, so cert would have to be ordered. so not definite he is yours.

However there is a Lydia Lawrenson living in 1901 about a 10 min walk from Edge Lane , father John, mother Bessie.
RG13; Piece: 3502; Folio: 8; Page: 8

Now having said all that..I notice a marriage in 1912 at Holborn, London to a Daisy C Dennett

Perhaps someone on here may be able to look at a later date than 1901 for you to see if Edward and Lydia are in close proximity or is he listed in any directories

Simone x

[MaryA]

At around 1910/1912 Edward A is still in Liverpool with his mother Elizabeth 45, Gwladys Lilian 19, Elsie May 18, and Margaret Josephine 16. I thought his name had been badly transcribed but I've just noticed that his mother's name is the same, so he's Edward Athya too.

I suggest you get the 1911 census, available on credits http://www.1911census.co.uk.

[dickiesam]

Hello John,
Do you have a YoB for that cousin Fred [Watts?]? Was he a Frederick or an Alfred or...? And did he have a middle name/initial? Would help us find out what happened to him.

Re Edward's birth...
Births Sep 1889 - Watts, Edward Athya - W. Derby - 8b - 558.

In the 1891 census his father John is a Shoe & Leather Dealer born in Billingborough, Northamptonshire. RG12 - Piece: 2993 - Folio: 53 - Page: 51.

My school days memory told me that Northamptonshire was where the finest boots and shoes were made.

Dickiesam

[MaryA]

I would suspect Simone is correct about the marriage to Lydia Lawrenson, although you would need to verify it with the certificate. Again about 1910/1912 the Lydia she mentions appears to be still single and living with mother Bessie and an Aubrey Valentine Lawrenson age 5.

I suspect this couple had at least three children, John EJ born 1914, Jean L in 1918 and Maud in 1920.

[Hilary]

Your quite right Dickie Sam

Years ago I lived in Wellingborough so I was interested to see where the Watts family were living and in 1881 I found 3 Watts families living at 53, 54, and 55 Midland Road all involved in shoemaking, one had quite a large concern. I suspect the families were brothers. I vagualy rmember a shoe factory in the Midland Road area (it was nearly 40 years ago) - I wonder if it was Watts!!!

Hilary
Ed Officer

[jan44]

The 1912 marriage is on the anc site under London marriages, the actual marriage cert can be viewed online.

Jan

[MaryA]

The 1912 marriage in London is in the name of Edward Albert Watts, as was his father's, so I don't think it's correct.

[simone]

Nice one Jan/ Mary

That rules the London one out then

Simone x

[Tina]

1938 Directory
Edward Athya Watts 80 Nicander Rd Lpl 15 no occ

(I remember this road very well, it was lovely, as kids we would turn off into a side st which brought us to Greenbank Park)

Tina

[jgharris]

Thank you all for your responses.

To deal with them one at a time:

Simone: you are correct about the number on Edge Lane. I do not know where I got 161 from. It was #4. My mother was born there. Her Dad was a Canadian Sea Captain who got to know the family through the Masonic temple. She married my Dad during WW2 and came to Canada bringing me on the Queen Mary in 1946.

"Gertrude M", the neice living on Edge Lane was my Great Aunt Mim, whose stage name was Beryl Beresford, married to Leslie Hinton (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phonofilm). I last visited her in Croyden in 1978. Her picture is on the web-site I have given below.

There is no doubt now that Edward married Lydia Lawrenson. Most of what I have besides a few photos is the memory of what my grandmother Gwladys told me in the 50s and of a few summer visits to the UK but Lydia is correct.

marya: The "A" for Athya is an old Welsh name coming from the family of Elizabeth (Tiny) Watts, Edwards mother. It lives on in our family with my brother, and my daughter.

dickiesam: I believe that Fred (Frederick, not Alfred) was born in 1891, not clear if it was in Liverpool or Hants. I recall visiting him in 1962 somewhere in Kent and my brother insists that he visited my parents in Canada in the early 1970s. I am not sure about that.

marya: The children you have found are probably correct. I recall meeting John ("Johnnie") when I was very young. I do not know about Jean (have heard the name) or Maud (no recollection at all).

Ed Officer: I only found out about the Wellingborough connection a couple of weeks ago when I was in the library in Ottawa. If I find anything of interest in the future I will post it. No doubt that this is the same family. John Watts, Edward's father and his father were both in the shoe business.

Tina: where is Nicander Rd? Does "Lpl" mean Liverpool? Living so far away I do not know short forms.

If anyone is interested I can probably come up with information about the Roberts family of Liverpool. Edward's sister Elsie married Dr John Roberts (Dentist) and I knew his sister Sheila and brothers Stan, Richard (an Admiral in the Canadian navy) and Reggie as well as his Mother. There is a picture of John on the web-site I have given.

Thanks to all again.
John Harris
Merrickville Ontario.

Names of living people removed MA

[Hilary]

The Watts families in Wellingborough in 1881 are

53 Midland Road
Joseph Watts 44 upper shoe closer bn Wellingborough
Margaret his wife 35 bn London
Fred 20 clerk
John son 18 clicker
Marian 14 shoemaker
Clare 13
all children bn W'borough

54 Midland Road
Thomas watts 37 shoe manufacturer employing 100 males and 1 female
Emma wife 36
Hannah 11
Thomas 9
Edith 6
Alfred 5
Edgar 1
infant 3 days
all bn W'borough

55 Midland Rd Wellingborough
George Watts shoe upper closer emp 1 male 4 boys
Jane wife 47
Elizabeth 18
George 12
John 10
Sarah 7
Nelly 6

By age your John Watts has to be the son of Joseph Watts

Joseph Watts is living at 78 Smith St Kirkdale in 1891
Joseph Watts 53 boot merchant bn W'borough
Margaret wife 46 bn Bow Bells London
Clara Watts 22 boot manageress

As you said the Fred you are looking for is the cousin to Edward he must be the son of John's brother Fred

1891 census 42 Church Rd West Derby
Frederick Watts 29 bootfactor agent bn W'borough
Sarah 21
Marion 1
Frederick 8 months

all but the father bn Liverpool
There are two servants in the house

Frederick Watts birth registration should show in 1890 under West Derby

HIlary
Ed Officer

[Hilary]

1901 census 22 Avondale Doad Southport
Clara hesketh head widow 30 boarding house keeperbn W'borough
Margaret Watts mother 56 bn London
Frederick Watts nephew 10 bn Liverpool
Sarah J Watts cousin 25 bn W'borough
4 boarders

Hilary
Ed Officer

[Hilary]

Birth registration
Frederick Watts September Quarter West derby volume 8b page 607

Best death registration match appears to be Frederick Watts born 7 August 1890 death Sept Quarter 1975 Kingston upon Thames (not Kent but you said London in your first post so could be near enough!!)

Hilary
Ed Offcier

[Tina]

Hi J.H
Sorry about Lpl yes Liverpool, posh part too of Wavertree!
If you go to this link, you will find Nicander Rd.
Not far from the famous Penny Lane
Tina

http://www.streetmap.co.uk/

[jgharris]

Once again thanks to all.

I am sure that Joseph Watts was John Watts Father. From the limited information I can get it seems that Joseph's Father was also "John" (b 1811) and that he was married to Sarah b 1805.

John's brother Fred was the Father of Miriam (Mim, not Marion) and of Frederick who was the other one I was looking for. Fred's death in 1975 sounds right, just before my Grandmother, his cousin died in Canada. Kingston also sounds correct as his place of death. I was very young when we visited him and I may have got a later visit with Mim mixed up with visiting him.

The information about Clara in Southport also sounds correct, as my Grandmother's sister also lived there. I did not have the name "Hesketh" though I did know that she was widowed.

John