Carts Ladys selling Veggie in Liverpool

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angelawaldenconahey75

Carts Ladys selling Veggie in Liverpool

Post by angelawaldenconahey75 »

I have found out that my Great GrandMother Margaret Quine-Caldwell was a Cart Lady who had her own Veggie Cart and then years later a stall in the possible St.John Market.So i ask my Mum you mean like My Fair Lady and she said Yes.With Shawl and Black Dress and Button boots.
My Great GrandMother Was 21yrs old in 1901 and was Married to John Duncan Caldwell who was 23yrs old in 1901.Trying to find any info on My Great GrandMother. She remarried in December 1914 to Thomas Hallmark after John Died.
My grandfather Alexander and his oldest brother John and youngest brother William helped by picking up bruised Veggies for there dinner.
So if any one has any info on the Cart People and Stall owners in the early 1900 in Liverpool and St.John's Market where after she upgrade from Corner to Stall.

My Aunt Pearl still lives in Liverpool and my Mum is with me in Florida.

I am very proud of my Liverpool Roots and want to find as much info that i can.

Angela
Sunny Florida
:P
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dickiesam
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Ladies selling Veggie in Liverpool

Post by dickiesam »

Hello Angela,
As far as I can remember we used to call those hard-working women Shawlies. Others in this crew will either confirm that or tell me my memory is at fault.

My paternal g.father sold books from a hand-cart in John's Market circa 1907 to 1925, as well as being a cooper by trade.

Dickiesam
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PJLong
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Post by PJLong »

Morning Angela,
Got my GGrandmother - Annie Lindsay, aged 36 - on the 1911 census living in Dawson Place, off Hunter St. Her occupation is "Hawker of Fruit". Wonder if she was on the same patch? Possibly a buddie of your Margaret! Sadly Annie died that year.
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Tina
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Post by Tina »

Hi Angela
Earlier than that, they were known as Mary Ellen's..
Many Irish females took to being hawkers, with their familiar shawls & black clothing.
My Ed's gt gt grannie was a hawker in 1851, 2 daughters no occupation, bit of a worry as they had "rooms" in a notorious red light area :oops:

Tina
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Tina
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Post by Tina »

Hi again Angela
Like yourself I'm proud to be a Scouse..I like to think my humour has rubbed off on my two Aussie grandees..
I looked in 1911 Directory at St John's market, got side tracked a bit, so many interesting sellers....patent medical mixtures, tripe stalls...
Sorry, couldn't find Margaret, perhaps the wrong time frame?
Tina :D
  • Tina

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Pegasus
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Post by Pegasus »

There were indeed many Ladies trading from Carts in Liverpool!

One of My Favourite Teachers was put through School, College & University with the Help of His Mother & Sister Trading in & Around Castle Street!
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dickiesam
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Shawlies and Mary Ellens

Post by dickiesam »

PJLong wrote:Morning Angela,
Got my GGrandmother - Annie Lindsay, aged 36 - on the 1911 census living in Dawson Place, off Hunter St. Her occupation is "Hawker of Fruit".
Small world! My paternal g.father who bought and sold books from a handcart in John's Market at weekends had a book shop in Upper Dawson Street. Think it was # 22. I suspect Dawson Place was pretty closeby. Perhaps this is the corner of it?

Image

The family lived in Hunter Street at the time.

Dickiesam
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Emery, McAnaspie/McAnaspri etc, Fry, McGibbon/McKibbion etc, Burbage, Butler, Brady, Foulkes, Sarsfield, Moon [Bristol & Cornwall].
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BurscoughLad

Post by BurscoughLad »

Hi Angela,

My father had his first fruit & veg shop in Smith Street, just off Scotland Road in the late 1930's.
The second shop, where I was brought up until I was eleven, was on Stanley Road, close to the Commercial Road / Melrose Road junction.
I used to go to the Cazneau Street fruit & veg market with my dad occasionally. The carters were still very much in evidence in the early 1950's.
There used to be a number on the street corners on County Road in Walton.

I had an "adopted gran" who regularly wore a black shawl and several women used to come into the shop as customers wearing them.
How times have changed!! :roll:
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Pegasus
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Post by Pegasus »

Burscough Lad.

There were a few (some Large) stables around the area, the Biggest was in Dalrymple Street.

My Maternal Grandfather stabled his Horse There!

The man whose Job was to look after the stables & Horses over the weekend was called 'Clance' (I don't know if that was his first or last name).
Searching for:
Bennett, Brown, Brunn, Collins, Critchley, Dickinson, Dodd, Duffy, Eaton, Edwards, Hertzberger, Highton, Holland, Humphreys, Melling, Morgan, Murphy, Walker, Webster, Wright, Owens, Prudon & Speed.
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garstonite
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Post by garstonite »

Hiya Angela....I am 59 and I remember the F&Veg cart sellers well...still have them here in Liverpool but all men now...only about 4 left...the women wore Black shawls / Black skirts / Black boots and they all looked about 80 yrs old...and they were well known for their work for kids...they would go to kids homes and the Childrens Hospital at the end of the days work and give the remaing fruit to the kids "to stop Scurvey "...great characters......being in the wind and rain and sun all day they all had skin like leather....but all looked like they could be your nan...lovely warm women....
I have checked for a marriage here in Liverpool on www.freebmd.org.uk and on www.lancashirebmd.org.uk .... no luck
I will check on www.lan-opc.org.uk ....allan :)
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garstonite
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Post by garstonite »

Hiya Angela....some success....
Babtism 12th february 1882 at St Martin in the Field, Liverpool
born 26th January 1882
JOHN DUNCAN RICHIE CALDWELL
son of John Duncan Richie Caldwell and Mary Jane
abode 34Court 4 House Hornby Street
occupation labourer
babtised by T Richards Curate

as you had to be 21 to marry without your parents consent , they may well have told a little white lie on the 1901 census ...John would only be 19....that`s if this is YOUR John....can`t see there being more than one John Duncan Caldwell at that time though..

can`t find the marriage though.....Margaret Quine ( Quinn ) could well have been an Irish lady and they may have married in a RC church....I`ll keep looking.....allan :wink:
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garstonite
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Post by garstonite »

Bingo....he married under Duncan NOT John

17th June 1900 at ST Polycarp church Everton,Lancashire
Duncan Caldwell to Margaret Jane Quine
groom aged 23
bride aged 21
grooms father JAMES CALDWELL ..(so forget my previous post re 1882 babtism)
it`s on www.familysearch.org

so Margaret was born 1878 or 1879
John was born 1876 or 1877 .....I`ll keep looking...nice to see they married in EVERTON....that`s my team ...lol.... :D .allan
added
on www.lancashirebmd.org.uk

CALDWELL Duncan to QUINE Margaret J at St Polycarp ,Everton . Liverpool
reistration number was 2124WD/1/254 this will cost about £9-50 if you wanted to buy the marriage certificate.......allan
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garstonite
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Post by garstonite »

HA HA.....I`ve just seen your other thread.....well that was a waste of time wasn`t it ?...lol....never mind....allan :wink:
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MaryA
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Post by MaryA »

Sorry Allan, it was difficult to stop Angela's threads overlapping. In this case I hoped the subject would stay on the occupation of "shawlies".
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angelawaldenconahey75

Thank-you

Post by angelawaldenconahey75 »

Allen thank you so much for taking the time to try and find info.
I realize that having three threads on this site some of my info is repeated and i am sorry.
I am a beginner at this researching and learning.

Everyone who has wrote me on this Thread i want to say Thank-you.

I am enjoying reading all the things that you have found and i am very proud of my Liverpool Roots.My Aunt Pearl and her Son Brian still live in Liverpool they are the only once left everyone else moved to other places.

Angela :roll:
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garstonite
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Post by garstonite »

Angela....no problem whatsoever...I enjoy the look-ups...it`s all about educating myself as well.....don`t worry about it...haven`t had a thread about "barrow boys " before ...good fun....allan :)
By The Way...go to
www.yoliverpool.com and register free ..when you are a member you can view all the posts...you will have fun reading about Liverpool....try this thread
http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/forumd ... ommunities


allan :wink:

added... http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showth ... post278498
, I have posted this for you I hope that`s OK....allan
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PJLong
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Post by PJLong »

Hi D.S. It's great we all seem to have "previous" in the same areas! My lot lived at no 1 Dawson Place. In brackets on the 1911 census it says "off Hunter St". That same year my GGrandma died. Two years later my Granddad and his brother were sent to Dumfries Industrial School as their father was imprisoned. The entry records have William Lindsay's crime as "child neglect" he got 4 months! Still have to get the details of that one :?
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taj1

fruiterers

Post by taj1 »

Hi Angela

My Great grandparents were known as fruiterers on their death certificates .

My Great Grandmother used to have a cart on Stanhope st ( toxteth) in the 1920's/30's selling fruit & vegetables. One of my great cousins tells me that when he was born ,he was wrapped in a blanket under her cart in a orange box !!! ( you'd never get away with that now ) .
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