Liverpool & South West Lancashire FHS - Forum

Hi,
I am new to the site, was born in Liverpool now living in the Black Country in the West Midlands,
I have been working on my tree for a couple of years, but get stuck on my Great Grandmother on my Fathers side...
I cannot find her in the census with her parents after she was born, (I think I may have found one but will confer it with one that you may find) ............
Sarah Daley (could be DALY) 01/05/1859 Liverpool Lancashire baptised in a catholic church (Our Lady of Reconciliation de La Saletteas) as Sarah Daly, Mother is Maria Daley...
Found fathers name on Marriage cert to my great grandfather Joseph Gibson in 29th April 1877 he is named as John Daley, My Great - Grandfather Joseph died in 1901 and Sarah remarried in 1906 to a John Cropper , she died in 1936 and is buried in Ford cemetery, That is a lot but I cannot go back because I can not find her parents birth's, they possibly came over from Ireland...can anyone help. I would love to solve this, have had to solve lots over the last couple of years but this has got me stumped.

Hi Colin,
Have you considered this one,

1861, Liverpool,

Mary Daley, head, 1839 , Bn Ireland, labourers wife,
Sarah Ann Daley, daughter, 1859, bn Liverpool,

Rg 9 Piece 2659 Folio 9B page 13


Bert

Hi and welcome,
A few questions...
What was Sarah's father's occupation on her marriage cert? Is he shown as deceased on the cert and do you know if Sarah had any siblings? Also, post the names of the witnesses at the marriage.

It is possible that Sarah's father was absent from the household in that 1861 census that Bertieone posted because he was away labouring. If he was Irish many Irish labourers were working as navvies on a multitude of projects such as canal building etc.
Found this possible for the parents in 1871:
DAILY, John - Head - 62 - 1809 - Labourer - Ireland.
DAILY, Mary - Wife - 32 - 1839 - Ireland
Address: 72 Caryl Street, Toxteth Park, Liverpool
RG10 - 3795 - 75 - 36

Followed by the only candidate in the area..
DALEY, Sarah - Servant - 14 - 1857 - General servant - Liverpool.
Address: Elias Street, Everton, Liverpool
RG10 - 3814 - 94 - 13

Unless Sarah's baptism cert gives a definite date of birth it cannot be depended on as a guide to the year she was born. Children were baptised late for a variety of reasons. What age is given for her on her marriage cert?

Hi
Have see the above one but will look into the others, I am sure they didnt live in Toxteth, but wont rule it out....
On the Marriage cert. Father John Daly is a Stonemason and Josephs father a Plasterer as the family went back to the 1700's as slaters and plasterers , the witness's are a Thomas Beswick and Isabella Gibson and both Joseph and Sarah are living in Gt Homer Street at the time of the marriage...

Her birthdate on her cert is 1st may 1859 but her age given on her marriage cert is 19 so isnt that two years difference, ....as they married 29th April 1877. on the birth cert there is a Margaret mentioned I assume that may be her Aunt. her mothers sister.

Colin007 wrote:Her birth date on her cert is 1st may 1859 but her age given on her marriage cert is 19 so isn't that two years difference, ....as they married 29th April 1877.

Hi Colin,
You are referring to a baptism cert? Is that date definitely shown as her birth date or it is the baptism date?
I assume Margaret was a sponsor at the baptism? What is her surname?

Sarah Daly




Birth Date:

1 May 1859



Baptism Date:

4 May 1859



Parish:

Our Lady of Reconciliation de La Salette



Father's Name:

Maria Daly

from Ancestry DS

the above is correct and that is what I have....but anything before nothing, I have to come off for a couple of days as I am off for minor op on my ear, will be back on Friday unless I can get it on my phone on the hospital, but thanks for the help you all have given and it is most appreciated, there are a few more niggles in my tree you may help with if you all dont mind...

Hi Colin,
Post those niggles! We love 'em and sometimes have a success!

And... It is possible Sarah's birth was not registered. Up to the 1870s it was the remit of the Registrar to seek out/find births in his area by whatever means he could, word of mouth, the parish priest, etc. He was paid by 'the each'. After the change it was the mother's legal duty to report the birth. It has been reckoned that as many as 15% of all births were not registered.

To complicate matters, I have seen births registered up a year late and it is the year of registration that shows up in a search of the GRO Index. I have come across extremes where someone perhaps applies for a copy their birth cert only to be told they don't exist! One was in 1938 and the person 'knew' they had been born in 1901. It was eventually resolved by the GRO adding the birth by a written notation at the foot of the list of names on the Index for 1901. The birth however was officially registered in 1938 and the written notation referred to the particular quarterly index for 1938. It is quite common to see those notations at the bottom of the Index pages.

As far as I can see the baptism entry implies that the child was illegitimate (no father given). If the mother later married the child may well have been known by that name. However as he was known as Daley and a father given at marriage is it not possible his mother was not actually Daley when she had him and therefore his birth name would not have been Daley?


The other alternative is that the baptism you have found is not his!