Liverpool & South West Lancashire FHS - Forum

Hi everyone

It is a few weeks since I needed your help and was wandering if anyone out there is willing again to try and help me. I have got the information regarding the marriage of Christopher Thomas Bowles d.o.b.1843 and Ann Baylis d.o.b 1849. They were married in St Marys Church in Widnes on 27th Dec 1871 - his father was also Christopher Thomas Bowles(a waterman) and her father was John Baylis(a blockmaker). I am trying to find census information about both parents and their relations with no luck. I know that according to 1841 and 1851 census Christopher Thomas Bowles Jnr was living with his aunt and uncle the Carrs. I have checked for birth info but no luck . Can anyone help.

Regards Midgei

First off I've moved this to Widnes as the marriage took place there and it would seem to be a good starting point.

Then you have a number of threads all relating to this issue and I would prefer to avoid having people duplicate what has already been suggested or looked for.

So any history may be found here or here

It would be best to make life easier for anybody who wishes to help so please provide full details from the marriage certificate including the age and occupation they give, the addresses and witnesses as well as those for their fathers.

It appears that Christopher Bowles was born in Norfolk not Lancashire, have you contacted the Norfolk Family History Society who might be expected to have more resources for that County than we have, as previously advised by our Education Officer, the coverage is very poor for Norfolk on the IGI so our hands are tied to some extent.

It would be a good idea to give the details of the censuses that you have so that we know what we are looking for and where.

Hi MaryA

Have checked Norfolk FHS but no luck. The info on marriage cert as follows:

St Marys Widnes, 27th Dec 1871
Christopher Thomas Bowles - Waterman (age 28 ) and his father exactly same.(except for age)
Ann Baylis age 22, spinster living with parents - father John Baylis - Blockmaker.
Witnesses On Bowles side- John Alfred Armstrong
On Baylis side - Elizabeth Baylis.
Vicar W Whitecliffe

1841 census as follows
HO107;Piece 794;book 5;civil parish: Great Yarmouth; County:Norfolk;Enumeration district:14;folio:32Page 18
Christopher Bowles age 4
WilliamCarr age 39- Mariner
Ann Carr-age 39
Living in row 79, Great Yarmouth

1851 Census
HO107;piece 1806;folio:98; page28
Address as above
Christopher Bowles age 14
William Carr age49 - mariner - birth place Gorleston, Norfolk
Ann Carr age 49 birth place Clipsby, Norfolk

He does not appear on 1861 census

Regards Midgei

And the address on Christopher's marriage certificate was blank? and Ann's was specifically "living with parents"?

Christopher Bowles is William and Ann Carr's nephew. The most likely reason he is living with them is that his parents are dead.

As has been said before there is poor coverage of Norfolk on the IGI. There are some christenings and marriages for Yarmouth on Ancestry however they have no burials.

My friend has Norfolk ancestry and we found that there were really only 2 ways of trying to find her family history, one was to hire a researcher in Norfolk and two to go to Norfolk. We chose the latter and spent a week near the Norfolk Broads. Two full days were spent researching and we also visited many churches museums and had boat trips to get the feel of the place.

Yarmouth library says it has a lot but it is extremely difficult to access and
I cannot recommend it. Norfolk Archives at Norwich were really good and we wished we'd spent our 2 days there.

As you know Christopher's baptism is not at St Nicholas at Yarmouth you have to widen you search. You need to find out how William and Ann Carr relate to the family. This information is not at present to be found on the web which is why I suggest the 2 possible alternatives for finding things out.

Incidentally we're going back in 2010 to carry on our researches and it's not even my family! That's family history for you.

Ed Offcier

1881 at 68 Teulon Street, Kirkdale gives the birthplaces, so hopefully all background information may now be in one place.

Christopher Bowles Head M 42 Rigger Yarmouth Norfolk
Annie Wife M 29 Dressmaker Runcorn Cheshire
Christa daur 9 Scholar Birkenhead
Samuel son 7 " "
Mary Ann daur 5 " "
John son 2 "
Elizabeth daur 4 months Liverpool
RG11; Piece: 3676; Folio: 38; Page: 14

Thanks for your help

Will keep on digging to see if anything else crops up.

A good reason to visit beautiful part of world I have not yet seen.

Regards Midgei

Norfolk FHS www.norfolkfhs.org.uk have a look up service for their members

Members Research Services
Introduction to the Look-Up Service
The Society offers a Look-Up service free of charge for Members who are unable to visit Norfolk and aims to enable Members with family history enquiries. The service is provided by volunteers who are able to check the wide range of genealogical, family history and local history resources held by the Society at Kirby Hall.

Their membership is £10 a year same as ours Liverpool & S W Lancashire FHS.

This could be cheaper than researcher or a visit.

Ed Officer

Ed officer

Thanks a lot think I may use that service.

Dont know how you know all this info thought I was quite good but you all leave me standing. Thanks again.

Regards Midgei

Will let you know if I find anything about family

Midgei wrote: Have checked Norfolk FHS but no luck.

Local FHS can often help, but I thought you had done that.

I just googled Norfolk Family History Society

Ed Officer

I think if you check the 1861 census for Toxteth Park, 2 Pleasant Hill Street, you might just find your Ann under the name Bailey.
RG9; Piece: 2699; Folio: 94; Page: 36