Liverpool & South West Lancashire FHS - Forum

I am an experienced genealogist suddenly faced with a crumbling brick wall that leaves me in Liverpool. I have no experience with Liverpool collections, am booking a space at the archives for Tuesday and Wednesday, but struggling to find out what would be available. Local experience and advice would be very welcome.

There are two mariner families who settled in Liverpool. Alexander Macdonald (born 1798 in Orkney) and his wife Grace Mackay (1816, Sutherland) had three children in Scotland (Ann, Colonia and Sandy, 1835-1840) and 5 more in Liverpool, Ellen (1845), Colin, William, John and Barbara (1857). They lived in Litherland Alley (1851), Greenland Street, (1861) and Gore Street (1871). Father was a shopkeeper and later a dock labourer. Almost all the children had sea-faring careers. My great-grandfather, William, was a cook for Gordon Bennett on his trans-Atlantic yacht. Gordon Bennett - if his name isn't familiar, look him up for a laugh.

The children went to school - but the registers don't seem to go back that far.

The second family were John Walker, my great-great-granduncle born in Newcastle West, Limerick 1828,his wife Ellen McNamara, and four children, Mary Jane, John, James and Lizzie. They lived in Hornby Street in 1871. Young John died in Liverpool, late 1871, early '72. There were two 9-year-old John Walkers dying then and I'd like to work out which was mine. Father John was a sailor who was lost at sea in May 1872. Wife Ellen moved with the children to New York about then and gave birth a few weeks later, in July 1872 and named the baby John.

Those children also would have gone to school. Both families were Roman Catholic but I haven't found baptism records for any.

The two families are linked by William marrying the niece of John Walker in New York in 1878. Ellen Lamb's parents ran a sailors' home in New York City, and William was cooking for them. Am I right to imagine the Liverpool docks were a small world?

Please, any advice you can give me, like parish names, cemeteries and death records (I haven't pinned them down for Alexander or Grace), and local sources. It will all be much appreciated. Were there any social societies or mutual savings that might have records?

Thanks,
Jessica Skippon

?
Not sure with this, could be McManus.


Name: Joannes Walker
[John Walker]
Age: 0
Birth Date: 12 Apr 1862
Baptism Date: 16 Apr 1862
Baptism Place: Our Lady of Reconciliation de La Salette, Liverpool, Lancashire, England

Father: Joannes Walker
Mother: Ellen Walker

Hi and welcome to the forum.

One of the main RC cemeteries would be Ford, which opened in 1859, although there are many other RC sections in say, Toxteth Park Cemetery, or at that date even in an RC Church. Ford records are on Ancestry - search the Card Catalogue for Liverpool Burials, if you find one of interest take careful note of the Section and Grave Number, then on the back wall of the library there are numerous boxes of microfiche, one is Number 26 which is for the three RC cemeteries. The back part of this box is for the reverse look up and will tell you who else is in that grave.

It's a little difficult at this distance since our Help Desk is currently in abeyance until we review the situation at the end of the year, but perhaps if you forward your tale to the archivists perhaps they will have time to think about what archives you may need to view and perhaps have some ready for you.

Many RC baptisms are also on Ancestry, as you will notice from the one that Bertieone has posted, it's usually safer to search with just a surname and a wide-ish date and carefully check the first names and parents names that are given, this is because a priest usually tried to latinicise the first names. You will also notice that very usefully most of the RC baptisms include the mother's maiden name which helps to be sure you have the correct entries.

Although Liverpool is a small place, it's also a big place with many parishes, if you can identify where the streets of interest are, perhaps check this site for C1900 street names, http://justme.org.uk/code/index.html you should be able to correlate the areas with the map of RC parishes which will be available at the library.

St Albans,

James Walker, birth reg, June Qtr, 1865, mmn, Mcnamara, GRO

St Albans,

Lizzie,

Possible for Alexander,

Seaman and died in the Workhouse,

Name: Alex McDonald
Age: 77
Record Type: Burial
Birth Date: abt 1794
Death Date: abt 1871
Burial Date: 14 Aug 1871
Burial Place: Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Cemetery Section: Non-Conformist

Possible for Grace,

Name: Grace McDonald
Estimated birth year: abt 1812
Registration Year: 1890
Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep
Age at Death: 78
Registration district: West Derby

John Walker 1862-1871



Anfield Cemetery,
Name: John Walker
Age: 9
Record Type: Burial
Birth Date: abt 1862
Death Date: abt 1871
Burial Date: 28 Sep 1871
Burial Place: Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Cemetery Section: Roman Catholic

Portion of Message received from Jessica,

"Thank you so much for sending these. Where did you find them? Especially
Alexander and Grace, I hadn't found them anywhere. Are the workhouse
records online or at the Archives?"

Thank you Jessica,

Information found mainly on Ancestry.
Liverpool records office and FMP hold workhouse records, note, Alexander may have died in the workhouse infirmary and not as a workhouse inmate.
I don't subscribe to FMP.

jskippon wrote: ↑

27 Aug 2020 16:17

Both families were Roman Catholic but I haven't found baptism records for any.
Thanks,
Jessica Skippon

The marriage between Alexander & Grace, 1833, is recorded on Scotland's People, Church Of Scotland collection, therefore unlikely to be Catholics.

The children's baptisms may have a Liverpool Scottish church connection and perhaps not online?

Thank you for posting that Bert, at least we know she has responded, although for continuity its obviously better if it were on the post.

Jessica, when you go to the library remember to take two forms of ID with you so that you can register and get a library card and pin number, also book in advance a computer (in these days we need to plan ahead), you will then be able to use both full Ancestry and Findmypast on their computers, remember to ask the correct way to access these sites as the usual way from home of just typing the url in the address bar doesn't allow you the access.

Thank you, Bert and Mary A -

1. Yes, Bert, I am assuming he died in the infirmary. He had worked all his life and raised a big family, who were dispersing. His wife and son Colin were boarders in Gore Street in 1871 and she was listed as married. Two years ago I did an art and history project with a local school and got to know the workhouse well. Our GP is now on that site, and the open garden behind was the exercise area. Alexander is my first workhouse ancestor and I take it as a badge of honour.

2. Thanks for the registration information, Mary A. I emailed my request yesterday but didn't ask specifically for a computer. Doing that now.

3. I knew their Scottish events were Church of Scotland, and I will ask my DNA cousins about their families' religion. Wm and Grace's daughter Colinia Macdonald married Peter Bruce in Liverpool St Peter in July 1856. Their son, Peter Jr was baptised April 1857 at St Vincent de Paul, which is Catholic. What denomination was Liverpool St Peter? Google doesn't want to tell me.

Thanks, both -
Jessica

Liverpool St Peter, Church of England.

This may help,
https://www.genuki.org.uk/church_list/1657

This site is handy for finding where marriages took place, if Catholic for example, the marriage will be recorded as Registry office or Registrar attended.

http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/index.php

jskippon wrote: ↑

28 Aug 2020 10:29

What denomination was Liverpool St Peter? Google doesn't want to tell me.

You need to remember just how many parishes there were in Liverpool, which is why it's almost impossible to suggest a particular church to search, however, most are on Ancestry, BUT NOT ALL!

There were two St Peters, the one on Church Street was CofE, but the other on Seel Street, now Alma De Cuba restaurant, was RC.