Liverpool & South West Lancashire FHS - Forum

I am trying to search back to ancestors in Ireland before they moved to Liverpool in mid 19th Century. I found a comment in the Notes section of a marriage entry in the “Ireland, Catholic Parish Registers, 1655-1915” which said “By dispension of time”

Does anyone know what it means ?

Any/all suggestions welcome.

Info is below if anyone wants to look at the accrual entry.

Marriage:
John Kehoe to Ellen Lambert, Dec 1869, Wexford, Ireland.

Source Citation
Catholic Parish Registers, The National Library of Ireland; Dublin, Ireland; Microfilm Number: Microfilm 04254 / 03

Source Information
Ancestry.com. Ireland, Catholic Parish Registers, 1655-1915 [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: Ancestry.com Operations, Inc., 2016.

Original data:
Catholic Parish Registers, National Library of Ireland, Ireland. Published under the National Library of Ireland's Terms of Use of Material made available on registers.nli.ie.

"Dispensation"

"Matrimonial dispensation

A matrimonial dispensation is the relaxation in a particular case of an impediment prohibiting or annulling a marriage. It may be granted: (a) in favour of a contemplated marriage or to legitimize one already contracted; (b) in secret cases, or in public cases, or in both; (c) in foro interno only, or in foro externo (the latter includes also the former). Power of dispensing in foro interno is not always restricted to secret cases (casus occulti). These expressions are by no means identical.

The information in this section concerns Roman Catholic canon law in the early 20th century. The canon law in question was considerably changed by the 1917 Code of Canon Law and the 1983 Code of Canon Law and should not be considered to reflect the present situation."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dispensation_(canon_law)

Just out of curiosity I checked my Lambert family, also from Wexford, but unfortunately there is no Ellen amongst mine

Mary - thanks for looking.

I am trying to link my Kehoe ancestors in Liverpool to the Kehoes in Wexford. Nicholas Kehoe, b 20 Apr 1861 in Liverpool, d 23 Aug 1898 in Liverpool was my great grandfather. Nicolas Kehoe was the son of Edward Kehoe (b. about 1835. d1884) and Elizabeth Reeves (b1839. d1909). I know that Edward was born in Ireland (but not where) and Elizabeth was born in Wexford. They married on 12 Oct 1859 at St.Anthony's, Scotland Road.

I have an Ancestry DNA link to a descendant of John Kehoe and Ellen Lambert. John was b.abt 1849 in Wexford, and Ellen b 1849 in Wexford. They married in Dec 1869 in Wexford. I think the DNA link is probably through John and Ellen and I am trying to find out if/how they are related to my Kehoe ancestors in Liverpool.

Any thoughts you have would be welcome. I am afraid I have not had much success researching Irish records - which is a problem when my DNA profile is 77% Irish !

Bert - thanks for the definition - do you have any thoughts on what “By dispension of time” or “By dispensation of time” (it is hard to read on the record) could mean on this marriage record ?

Denis,

My initial thoughts are, no banns required, perhaps there's a license to be found?

Dispensation in time,

Dispensation=Exemption of a rule or usual requirement.

Banns would be the usual requirement and the time would be the time needed to read the banns.

No idea if it holds any significance, the previous marriage to John & Ellen and the following 9, all have Dispensation in time.

Bert

Thanks.

As you have pointed out all of the marriages on the following page, up to the year end, also have the same dispensation. It may be to do with marriages needing a dispensation to be performed during Advent ? Advent is normally the four weeks preceding Christmas Day so the five after Christmas Day also given a dispensation don't fit the theory - could be an overzealous parish priest, or a local diocese ruling ?

Denis,

Looked at another parish and noticed, Dispensation in Banns.

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/ ... 4667-00049

I'm wondering if its a case of the Banns being waived prior to the marriage and without a required licence?

"That on a Catholic marriage record there is a space left for the priest to record any comments about the marriage i.e. any dispensations that had to be obtained before the marriage could take place. A dispensation is an act of excusing from the observance of a law of the church, which is granted when there are special circumstances to justify non-observance of the law in a particular case."

For example:
Dispensatione a banns - dispensation from the required announcement of marriage banns
Dispensatione a cultus - dispensation obtained when either the bride or groom has requested to marry a non-baptised person.

The Irish Census of 1901 lists approx. 2.5k Kehoes. Of those, 1.5k were in Wexford.

The Griffith's Valuation of Wexford was completed in 1854. It may be useful to search for the Kehoes in the relevant parish:
http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/

Revision books, each covering several years, were created after the initial valuation. The Public Record Office of Northern Ireland have published their Revision Books online, but 'Revision Books for the twenty-six counties of Ireland can currently only be inspected in person at the Valuation Office in Dublin...'
http://timeline.ie/revision-books/

familysearch can sometimes be useful for Irish records. They show these children of John Kehoe and Ellen Lambert in the 1870's:

John 13th June 1872
Bridget 12th May 1874
Thomas 15th May 1876
Mary Ellen 8th July 1879
Michael 18th September 1870

Interestingly, they also show Nicholas Kehoe, born 4th March 1865, son of Nicholas Kehoe and Judy Lambert
https://familysearch.org/search/record/ ... 3Alambert~

Another friend in Wexford is checking to see if she has an Ellen Lambert amongst her Kehoe family. Will let you know if she has a result.

Another tree showing Edward's parents as John and Margaret:

https://www.ancestry.com/family-tree/pe ... 9255/facts

There are some dodgy spellings around; e.g. Edwd Kehe. You're up against the priest using Latin, using abbreviations, and modern transcription errors. If you think that Edward's parents were indeed 'John' and 'Margaret', you could do a trawl through the Wexford registers looking for likely births. It's a bit of an ordeal, but you've got the likely date as around 1834, so it shouldn't be too difficult. Mary will know the Wexford parishes...

The registers are here:
http://registers.nli.ie/

Luxor,

Thanks for the info.

The Tree you quote showing Edward's parents as John and Margaret is from my 3rd cousin. She lives in USA. We are working together to try to crack this Kehoe link.

The other info you sent is also useful - I'll see what it throws up.

Mary - thanks for your help. I hope your Wexford friend comes up with a link.