Liverpool & South West Lancashire FHS - Forum

Hi,
Looking for any help with ancestors with the surname Kay and Birch. My grandmother was Mina Kay who died in 1936 - 1937 she was married to John Birch. My mother was Sheila Birch and had a brother Dudley who was killed during World War 2, they lived, I think in Cooper St. in Liverpool or her Grandparents did. My mother was sent to Ireland and her father re - married, but because my Mother was so young when her mother died she does not remember any family member names so we do not have any family history and I would like to find some if I could. Can anyone help...

Hi and welcome to the forum.
Just making a start with the death of Mina Birch in Q3 1936 Wirral, Cheshire 8a 468 about age 50, so born about 1886.

You can order this certificate online using the above information at www.gro.gov.uk it might be useful to know who registered the death.

To progress further back you will need the marriage certificate, you are lucky, it is available online

17th November, 1919 at the Parish Church of St Clement, Toxteth Park
John Robert Birch age 40 Bachelor Marine Engineer
Residence at the time of marriage - Oakfield, Morda (or Horda) Road, Oswestry
Father John Birch (Deceased) Occupation Farmer
Mina Kay 33 Spinster of 7 Maynard Street
Father John Kay (Deceased) Shipwright
Both signed their names
Witnesses were Herbert H Smith and Harriet Ada Smith

Again lucky that I was able to find Mina on the Ancestry site for the 1911 census.
She is 26 years old working as a Hospital Sister at Linacre Lane Infectious Diseases Hospital, in Bootle.

Just to mention that both your mother and "Dudley" who is apparently John D, were born in Birkenhead, Cheshire.

As they married in 1919 there is a possibility that they moved around a bit, perhaps with his job? and if they resided for a short while in Huddersfield then there could be an older brother born there in 1921.

Marriage record image:-





Blue

I believe that is definitely Morda Road, Oswestry. If you google the full address you will see that Oakfield has now been split into flats, so presumably the building is still there.

What do people think of this as a possible death index for John R Birch:-

Name: John R Birch
Born: About 1879
Quarter: Jan/Feb/Mar
Year: 1944
Age: 65
District: Repton
County: Derbyshire
Volume: 7b
Page: 612


Blue

John Robert Birch's birth index:-

Name: John Robert Birch
Quarter: Jan/Feb/Mar
Year: 1879
District: Ellesmere
County: Shropshire
Volume: 6a
Page: 71


Blue

I did wonder about that entry, it also fits with an entry in the 1901 census for John Birch age 20, a Barman, who is boarding at 111 Merton Road, Bootle and gives his birthplace as Ellesmere, Shropshire.

The Birch family were from Baschurch, Shropshire there's a tree on Ancestry showing quite a few generations of this family.

Blue

Yes, the 1881 census specifically gives his name as John Robert, his father is John, 65, a farmer of 200 acres, employing 4 labourers, mother is Sarah, 41 from Selattyn, a baby sister only a few months old named Betsy Emma and the address is Weston, Baschurch.

I wouldn't mind betting it's a second marriage for father John.

This is the burial record of the Derbyshire John Robert Birch any chance of it being him:-

http://www.southderbyshirebdm.co.uk/per ... p?id=21164


Blue

The Ancestry tree showing the Birch family of Baschurch is probably mine, and Pam has now contacted me through Ancestry. From the marriage register entry I think we can be pretty certain that the John Robert Birch in my tree (who is there as a descendant of Mary Atcherley) is Pam's grandfather.

More info on the death of John's wife Mina can be found in her National Probate Calendar entry in 1936:

BIRCH Mina of Olcote 1 Stonehey-drive West Kirby Cheshire (wife of John Robert Birch) died 18 August 1936 at the Cottage Hospital Hoylake Cheshire Administration Liverpool 23 September to the said John Robert Birch chief engineer. Effects £1593 2s. 5d.

Her age at death gives her a year of birth of around 1885/6. Trouble is, there doesn't seem to be a Mina Kay who fits the bill in the records prior to the 1911 census. Most likely that's because Mina was not her birth name. I have a Jemima Atcherley in my tree who was known as Mina in adult life. Sure enough, there is a Jemima Kay born about 1885 at Liverpool to parents John Kay and his wife Isabella (probably Isabella Lambert, born Kendal, Westmorland abt 1855, but would need certificates to be certain). She was baptised 12 Oct 1887 at West Derby, but Ancestry seems only to have a transcript and not a copy of the original register. From the census records John Kay appears to have been a labourer who worked on the docks, rather than a shipwright, so perhaps there's an element of doubt there especially given the value of Mina's effects at her decease. Unless she 'embellished' a bit when it came to describing her late father's occupation (wouldn't have been the first or last time someone did that!), and maybe her personal estate was from her husband?

Details of the wartime death of Pam's uncle (Mina / Jemima's son) John Dudley Birch (not to be confused with the Royal Navy captain of the same name) can be found on the Aircrew Remembrance Society website:

http://www.aircrewremembrancesociety.co ... peter.html

And here's his page on the CWGC website:

http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casua ... N%20DUDLEY

Note that the latter shows John Dudley Birch as "Son of John R. and Mina Birch, of Renvyle, Co. Galway, Republic of Ireland." Mina had of course passed away before this time, but there's confirmation here of the family's move to Ireland, which may well be where John Robert Birch died. I suspect the Nottinghamshire death in 1944 was of another John Robert Birch, given his occupation.

Steve

Hi and welcome to the forum.

Atcherley-org-uk wrote:The Ancestry tree showing the Birch family of Baschurch is probably mine, and Pam has now contacted me through Ancestry.

I'm pleased that "Pam", presumably the original poster, has contacted you as they haven't responded to the time and research that we helped with.

Sorry everyone, I'd forgotten I had posted to this forum!!! Mary many thanks for all the help with the research. I didn't know Mina Kay (my Grandmother) had been a Hospital Sister but when I asked Mum (Sheila) her answer.. oh yes so she was, so thanks again. I also can't thank Peter enough, he has given me so much information and so much more to focus on. As you saw from the records John Robert Birch died in May 1956 age 77 and is buried I think in Greystones, Co. Wicklow (Near Dublin)
I will carry on with the search for Mina Kay-Birch's Family.
Regards and thank you all.
Pam xx