Liverpool & South West Lancashire FHS - Forum

I am looking for information regarding William James or James William Taylor. Married to Robina Connolly 1905 who died at the age of 47yrs in 1931 they had 6 children. Mr Taylor was remarried but estranged from his children. He was my grandfather, I would appreciate any information. I believe he lived to an old age and was originally from the West Derby area. Thanks to anyone that can help.

I would seem that you are looking to make contact with living relatives. This is quite difficult but we have tried to put together a few suggestions here http://www.forum.liverpool-genealogy.or ... =14&t=8154

Hi Valerie,
In view of MaryA'S post, are you trying to move forward to find relatives or back to his birth and beyond?
For moving back in time, have you got a copy of the cert for William's marriage to Robina?
Marriages Sep 1905 - W. Derby - 8b - 1061: CONNOLLY, Robina and TAYLOR, William.
That would give you his father's name and occupation. There are a lot of William Taylors in the 1901 census. And it would be easier to find him with his father's name.

In the later census he indicates his YoB as 1885, the same year as Robina, and addresses himself as William James. There are only 3 births in Liverpool in 1885 +/- 2 years, all in 1883.
Births Jun 1883:
TAYLOR, William James - Liverpool - 8b - 135
TAYLOR, William James - Liverpool - 8b - 110
Births Sep 1883:
TAYLOR, William James - W Derby - 8b - 494

Since you say he was originally from the West Derby area the W Derby registration is the most likely, but you need his father's name from the marriage cert in order to specify it when ordering the birth cert.

Do you know who and where he married after Robina's passing? These are deaths between 1945 and 1985 in Cheshire and Lancashire [Liverpool area], based on a YoB of 1883 +/- 2 years, but he could have moved anywhere, unfortunately.
Deaths:
TAYLOR, William J - [aged 80] - Cheshire, Wallasey - 1964.
TAYLOR, William J - [aged 72] - Lancashire, Liverpool North - 1957.
TAYLOR, William J - [aged 76] - Lancashire, Liverpool North - 1961.

DS

Hi Sorry I have never had a reply before so hope I am responding correctly. I am trying to find out information regarding ancestry. Because of the rift in the family I was told that both of my grandparents had died at the same time. I have only found out later that this was not the case. I am now in the States and all of my father's siblings are now deceased. I have in recent years become interested in my ancestry but obviously find it harder to find information now that I no longer live in Liverpool. I am in touch with cousins etc. who have as little information as I do. I have a copy of Robina & William's marriage certificate,his employment was a blacksmith at that time, his father a cotton porter. I know in later years he worked for the Liverpool Corporation but have not been able to find him as a child. The birth certificates that I have applied for have not been him, my father has his birthday in a 1936 diary as being January 6th he would have been 50years of age on that date but as I don't know where he was born the certificates I have requested from Liverpool have not been on that specific day. My father was meticulous about dates. I would really appreciate any help or leads I could persue.

I'm assuming that you have spent money on incorrect certificates, sorry about that. I think you would be better to approach the GRO in this instance, rather than the Liverpool Register Office. If you provided the exact date of birth that you have they would be able to check to see if they could find the correct entry, even if not in Liverpool - I hope they are lucky, Taylor not being a very uncommon name. You can contact them at http://www.gro.gov.uk

Don't worry, you can do almost as much research from abroad as you can if you were in England.

Please give the full details from the marriage certificate as these would help confirm Dickiesam's findings, since it will have the father's name on it.

Thanks for such a quick response. You are correct I have "wasted" money on certificates for both sides of my family.
Full information from Marriage Certificate: Married 8th August 1905... William Taylor age 21 yrs bachelor, Blacksmith 6 Lissant(or Lissart) Street, West Derby. Father William James Taylor, Cotton Porter. The certificate was issued at the District of West Derby County of Liverpool.

I did try the GRO for the birth certificate with just William's birthday and received a certificate showing mother Annie Taylor then it has a Warper in the same column, Small Lane, Golcar Huddersfield. No father showed nor occupation.,. I did not think this was correct because of a number of things, Huddersfield was a long way from Liverpool, so far to travel in those day. He had three daughters, none with the name Annie in any respect, their names Elizabeth, Helena and Winifred. They appear to have been raised Catholic, we were raised Catholic also. I am not bothered if he was born out of marriage, I just want to be able to go back and find out more of our roots. I guess I would also like to know if there are any other relatives either from his second marriage of if he had siblings and of course where his Mum & Dad came from.

I have also been working on Robina but ran into a dead end there because her father died young, he was a chemical plumber and it looks like he arrived in Liverpool from Ireland. Again with the Taylor name being common and the Connolly (which can be spelled in so many different ways) I have ran into dead ends.
'
Any more help or inspiration would be most appreciated.
Thanks
Val.

Sorry, will be on my way to bed in a minute, so can't spend much time looking into this, will try when I get a bit more time, although I suspect others might also jump in and help. Just wanted to ask the question - the birth in Huddersfield, was it the exact date you gave? or just near?

Hi Val
Lissant St was in Edge Hill off Overbury St (West Derby rego area)
No Taylor's at number 6 in 1911 Gores/Kellys Directory.
There is a baptism at St Philip Neri for a Robina Connolly
17 Jan 1885 to Michael & Anna/Ann/Annie nee Cox.
W.J & Robina had children Elizabeth bn 1906, Winifred 1908 & Helene 1910.
I'll send a private message

Tina

Hi again
Free BMD have 4 births Taylor with Connolly maiden name in West Derby
1912 to 1920.

Tina

Hi Valerie

Maybe a long shot, but there is a George Taylor, nephew, at 6 Lissart Street, Liverpool 1911 census



GRAHAM, John, Head, Married, M, 45 ,1866, Carter Contr, Liverpool Lancs

GRAHAM, Annie, Wife, Married, 20 years , F, 46 , 1865, Home, Liverpool Lancs

GRAHAM, Millisant, Daughter, Single, F, 17, 1894, Domestic Servant Come Home At Night, Liverpool Lancs

GRAHAM, Phebo, Daughter, Single, F, 15, 1896, Charwoman, Liverpool Lancs

TAYLOR, George, Nephew, Single, M, 18 , 1893, Carters Runner, Liverpool Lancs

GRAHAM, William, Son, M, 2, 1909

regards

Michelle

Hi,
The only William Taylor bn abt 1883 with a father William Taylor in the 1891 census in Liverpool is living at 27 Audley Street, Bootle. Parents Wm [Dock labourer, bn abt 1849 - Ireland] and Jane [bn abt 1857 Liverpool]. There are 5 siblings. RG12 - 2975 -37 -14.

If the Huddersfield birth cert has the exact date of birth on it I would seriously consider it to be the right one. He would have been illegitimate and it is quite possibly given up for fostering locally or to relatives in or near Liverpool. It is not unusual for someone in that situation to give a fictitious name at their marriage. It is also possible he was told his father's name, but oddly it is the same forename as his unmarried mother if the Huddersfield cert is correct. If he was raised in Liverpool he had every reason to believe he was born there.

Checked Small Lane, Golcar in 1881. There are 2 Annie Taylors living there. One was bn abt 1872, the other abt 1869. The latter is abt the right age for a problem pregnancy in 1884. Her father is William...
TAYLOR, William - Head - Md - 51 - Green Grocer - Golcar, Yorkshire.
TAYLOR, Sarah - Wife - 49 - Golcar, Yorkshire
TAYLOR, Clara - Dtr - u/m - 19 - Servant - Golcar, Yorkshire.
TAYLOR, Sarah E - Dtr - 16 - Woollen Warper - Golcar, Yorkshire.
TAYLOR, Annie - Dtr - 12 - Scholar - Golcar, Yorkshire.
TAYLOR, Joshua - Son - 10 - Golcar, Yorkshire.

Address: Small Lane, Golcar, Yorkshire (West Riding).
RG11 - Piece:4390 - Folio:78 - Page:31.

Note that dtr Sarah's occupation is the same as Annie's on the birth cert.

DS

Wow!Thank you this is fascinating! I didn't know what the Warper notation was but it seems like it was her profession. The only problem is that we will probably never know who the father is now. I think he also said that he was 21yrs old when he got married when in fact he was only 19 . He probably had never seen his birth certificate and I know a lot of people actually didn't know the year they were born. Looks like I am not going to find out anything more about William's father a cotton porter was also very common in those days.

Looks like Annie's father is William perhaps my grandfather had heard of William through her. My Dad was actually William George. I might be able to go back and find out more about that side of the family.

I am absolutely overwhelmed with the help that I have received and can't Thank everyone enough.
Val.

Might have known this lot were night owls, but glad they carried on looking after I was sleeping. I would tend to agree that if the date on the certificate is an exact match to what you know, it is probably the correct one, despite the distance from Liverpool. It will be unfortunate but you may not get any further along that line.

I've sent a pm to Val with details of W.J & Robina from the census 10yrs after 1901, both were 26 yrs & W.J is a Corpie labr waste treatment plant, both bn Lpool.
9 Jane Terr off Kinglake St Edge Hill.
The baptism dated 1885 could be her, if age in census is correct.
Her age at death may have been guessed??

Michelle, there has to be a connection to George the nephew, good find.

Tina

Hi Valerie,
I should have explained that a warper was a person in the wool weaving trade who's job was to put a twist in the wool as it was being worked and to make sure the 'warp' didn't break. If you look at the people living in Small Lane, Golcar, you will see almost everyone over school age was connected to the weaving trade.

One of my sisters is a home-weaver so I knew this already.... The warp is the thread that runs the length of the fabric while the weft is the thread that runs back and forth across the fabric. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weaving

DS

Hi again,
Tina found a baptism that is probably your Robina and it is also on the Liverpool History Projects site: http://www.liverpoolhistoryprojects.co.uk/index.htm

ST PHILIP NERI - bn 1884 - bpt 1885 - ROBINA CONNOLLY - father MICHAEL - mother ANN - maiden name COX.

It is the only baptism to this family listed. Perhaps because the father died young as posted? Having trouble finding the parents' marriage though and Robina in 1891 and 1901.

DS

My thanks to everyone that has helped. I wonder if it would be possible to find from the Liverpool Corporation any information regarding William Taylor employed during the period of 1911 . Perhaps I would then be able to find out his death or maybe something that he had informed then regarding his past. I've had relatives in England that have tried to find out information but the Corporation has said they were archiving their information but we couldn't find out when this was going to be completed or if it was possible to access this information.

Any help I could get regarding accessing Liverpool Corporation records would be really helpful.
Thanks
Val.

Hello Val,
In the first half of the 20th century it is unlikely that William moved very far from his 'roots', and he considered Liverpool as home. The 3 deaths I found are the most likely candidates but unfortunately there's no way to check them for informants etc, without buying the certs.

Deaths:
TAYLOR, William J - [aged 72] - [bn abt 1885] - Lancashire, Liverpool North - 1957.
TAYLOR, William J - [aged 76] - [bn abt 1885] - Lancashire, Liverpool North - 1961.
TAYLOR, William J - [aged 80] - [bn abt 1884] - Cheshire, Wallasey - 1964.

On balance I would discount the Cheshire death, because there is a William J of the right age in the last census, bn Cheshire and living in the Wallasey area. Although it possible that William migrated 'across the water', the River Mersey, and retired on the other side.

Of the other 2 there were 3 William James Ts born in Liverpool between 1883 and 1886.
It is probable that at least 1 and possibly 2 might have died before 1901:
Deaths Dec 1883: Taylor, William James - 0 - W. Derby - 8b - 346.
Deaths Jun 1884: Taylor, William James - 2 - W Derby - 8b - 293.

You mentioned he apparently lived to 'a ripe old age'. Where did that information come from? Any snippet could help us find out where he settled on retirement.

DS

The information I had on William living to a ripe old age came from my mother. She actually saw him just one time when my brother was very young this would probably have been in 1944, she and my father where walking on Edge Lane and a gentleman doffed his hat to them. My Dad acknowledged this and then told my mother that it was his father, he would not stop or talk and kept on walking. My brother would have been the first boy (Williams first grandson) in the family. My father was actually the oldest son. My mother tried to talk to my father's sisters but no one would ever talk about him except to say that he had re-married very soon after their mother, Robina had died.

I have Robina's birth and death certificate and also what I think is her parent's marriage certificate. Although Robina's name on her birth certificate was Connolly and the marriage certificate of Hannah Cox (who made her mark) and Michael Conley, his occupation a Plumber. If she recorded the birth of Robina it is possible the wrong spelling. I have no other siblings for Robina though or of course William.

Once again Thank you to everyone, being here in the States makes it a little harder to come by information unless I spend money on the wrong certificates. The information I am getting from this site is outstanding and so typical of the people that I remember when I lived in Liverpool some 40 years ago.

I have another candidate for the death info for William Taylor. There is a man called William Taylor who had his funeral at St. Oswald's church, Old Swan. He was buried at Yew Tree Cemetery on the 6th February 1962. He lived in Broadgreen Road which is not far from Edge Lane. The record does not give his age but it appears to match the following death index. It's a few years out from what we are expecting but ages can be wrong on records:-

Name: William Taylor
Quarter: Jan/Feb/Mar
Year: 1962
Age: 75
District: Liverpool North
Vol: 10d
Page: 561


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