Liverpool & South West Lancashire FHS - Forum

Hi all,
I was wondering if anyone could please do a look up for me at the records office for Florence Loisa Bargery b 10th October 1899 at Upper Parliament Street.
Father was Joseph Edward Bargery, and mother was Annie. I'm interested in the mother's maiden name.
Any help will be greatly appreciated, thanks.
Garry

No need to do a look up, the baptism is online
Born 10th and baptised 30th October, 1899 at St Peter, Liverpool
Florence Louisa Bargery
Parents Joseph and Annie Bargery
Occupation Dispenser
Address Upper Parliament Street

Why do I get the feeling that you already have that information? possibly because you have the exact date of her birth.

There is nothing else that can be looked up in the Record Office, to get her mother's maiden name you will need to order her birth certificate, which you can do online at www.gro.gov.uk using the following reference
Q4 1899 Liverpool 8b 88

To try and work around it, do you know if she had any siblings? older or younger than her? Have you found the family in the 1901 census or even the 1911, which should give the number of years they were married and would make it easier to search for a marriage.

Maybe they told a few porkies!!

There's a marriage in 1910 for
Joseph E Bargery and Annie Jones in Cardiff
Sep qtr 11a 537

Could be way off the mark, but couldn't find any other Joseph Bargery marriages

Cheers
Erika

19ssshhhh census has a Joseph Edward Bargery bn 1872 in Cardiff, listed with Helena Jane aged 37yrs.
She's the other bride in the 1910 marr index Erika.
Annie Jones married John Carpenter.
Tina

Strangely there appears to be very few Bargery marriages, especially in Lancashire. I'm afraid the birth certificate will be the major item to give a clue about Annie.

Can anybody do an address check of the 1901 census to see if they are still in Upper Parlie Street?

Hi Mary
Nothing in 1911 Directory.
I cannot find them in 1901, not sure how to search for address.
Tried for Flo under so many combinations, also surname variations with no luck..no shipping in fmp..

Tina

Didnt realise how long a road it is! will take a while

MaryA wrote:Strangely there appears to be very few Bargery marriages, especially in Lancashire. I'm afraid the birth certificate will be the major item to give a clue about Annie.

Can anybody do an address check of the 1901 census to see if they are still in Upper Parlie Street?

Unfortunately there are over 250 dwellings listed in a street search for Upper Parliament Street. Too many to trawl through. In view of my later observations I think it was an accommodation address.
Spent a long time searching for Joseph, Annie, and the child Florence, together and separately, all counties.... Only found a Joseph, who happens to be a 'dispenser', but he's not married to an Annie.

BARGERY, Joseph - Head - Married - 55 - 1846 - Dispenser Of Medicine - Brompton, London.
BARGERY, Sanison - Wife - 50 - 1851 - Ireland. [think her name is Louisa]
BARGERY, Ethel - Dtr - U/m - 18 - 1883 - Portland, Dorsetshire.
KEOGH, Madge G F - Niece - u/m - 29 - 1872 - Hospital Nurse - Isle of Wight.
Address: 6 Guildford Street, St John, Cardiff, Glamorganshire.
RG13 Piece:4979 Folio:92 Page:12

Ten years later this one is still married to Louisa.

The one born 1872 and married to Helena Jane that Tina found is a 'Commercial traveller', bn Portsmouth. In the 1881 he and a sister Ada bn 1879 are with their parents Joseph and Louisa at the Royal Naval Hospital, Portland.
BARGERY, Joseph - Steward - Married - 38 - 1843 - Sick Berth Steward - Brompton, Kent.
BARGERY, Louisa - Cook - 30 - 1851 - Cook Attendant(Dom) - Dingle, Co Kerry, Ireland.
BARGERY, Joseph C E - Son - Single - 9 - 1872 - Landport, Hampshire .
BARGERY, Ada A - Dtr - 2 - 1879 - Portland, Dorset.
RG11 Piece: 2107 Folio:55 Page:2

Methinks Joseph Snr learnt his dispensing trade in the RN before going into Civvy Street. I also think Joseph Junior plied his trade of Commercial travelling in Liverpool [in the music hall joke sense as well] and is the father named in that baptism for Florence. He seems to have 'ducked' under the radar in the 1901 census. Ten years later he has been married for less than a year to Helena Jane Baker.

The question of porkies has been raised.. I think they were told at the baptism of Florence, and Joseph Junior and Annie were not married. Florence's birth cert would appear to be only source of Annie's maiden name. I also think that Annie and Florence are in the 1901 under Annie's maiden name.

DS

There is a 2 year old florence jones born 1899 in liverpool in the workhouse institution liverpool select vestry in 1901 Census

Clatterbridgegirl1967 wrote:There is a 2 year old florence jones born 1899 in liverpool in the workhouse institution liverpool select vestry in 1901 Census

Hi Ali,
You beat me to it!
JONES, Florence - Patient - 2 - 1899 - Liverpool.
Workhouse Institution, Liverpool Select Vestry, Penny Lane, Wavertree.
RG13 Piece:3505 Folio:101 Page:2

This Florence seems to be the only child without listed parents and I think is probably the child of Joseph and Annie in that baptism.

DS

Hi DS

Got fed up checking upper parliament st, it never used to seen that long when I drove down it years ago

Ali

Gut feeling is that Joseph Bargery who is a Dispenser has something to do with the baptism, although I suppose I shouldn't case nasturtiuns a cover up in the register saying that Annie is also Bargery. The address might be legit as she might have been living or working there under her own name.

Good find with little Flo Jones, I think there might be some records available for the Workhouse, wonder whether they will give any father's information.

Joseph Bargery is mentioned a number of times on Cardiff directories. On the 1914 Cardiff & Suburban Directory he is a dispenser for Cardiff Provident Dispensary in Guildford Street. His home address is Holyrood, Cadoxton Road, Dinas, Powis. The image below is from a directory from 1891:-






Blue

Dear all,
Thank you so much for your interest. In reply to all your questions:
This is extremely muddled from my perspective as I am trying to trace my wife's paternal grandmother, Maidie Bargery, and in my search someone came up with the birth of Florence Louisa whose parents were listed as Joseph Edward Bargery and Annie.
(I apologise at this stage if it seems familiar to some of you as I have posted a listing on this forum before.)
Florence's birth is the same day as Maidie's, as my mother in law told me.
Maidie's marriage certificate shows her first name as Maidie, and her father's as Edward who's profession was stated as a Registered Medical Practitiner.
Maidie did have a step brother from another of her mother's relationships, her mother's name was Bennett, and I realise the only sure way of ascertaining Florence's mother's maiden name is to apply for the birth certificate. I was maybe hoping there was some other means of finding out.
The reason for an interest in Florence Louisa is due to here dob, her mother's name, and also it has been impossible to find any information on Maidie Bargery (Bennett).
I am aware of Joseph Edward's marriage in 1910, but he first married in 1904 to Margaret Geogina Lane, and she died in 1907.
Therefore Joseph Edward and Annie were not married.
As a matter of interest in 1899 he was residing at 221 Upper parliament St, as a dispenser listed in Gores Directory 1900, but by 1901 census the property was listed 'not in occupation'. I am informed by a reliable source that in 1901 he was living in Cardiff, like his father.
Still no sign of mother and daughter in the 1901 census.
I'm not sure where the travelling salesman referrence comes from as I tend to believe he was connected with the medical profession in some way as he travelled to Kampala in Uganda. I have no info on Joseph’s travel to Africa. I don’t know who he went with, nor how he got there.
I have read that c1900AD there was a new rail link to Kampala, Uganda from Kenya. There was also a big new hospital built in Kampala at this time, which coincided with a huge outbreak of deadly sleeping sickness.
His son was born in 1905 and died in Uganda aged 9 months.
Anyway, I digress, sometimes assumptions are made, and for the sake of this enquiry I am assuming that Joseph Edward was known as Edward, as his father's name was also Joseph; and I am assuming that it would be incredible if Florence Louisa Bargery and Maidie Bargery were born on the same day in the same city, as Bargery is not a common name in Liverpool.
Meanwhile thanks again.
Reards,
Garry

Hi Garry,
Thank you for background to your search. Intrigued by your reference to Africa I found this:

The only male Bargery leaving a UK port for destinations in Africa in the FMP Outgoing Passengers List is a Reverend G P Bargery, usually described on the manifest as a Superintendent of Education. He is married and sometimes his wife travelled with him.

BARGERY, G P - YoB not entered - Sailed 1900 - Liverpool to Nigeria, Burutu.
BARGERY, G P - YoB not entered - " " 1908 - Liverpool to Nigeria, Forcados.
BARGERY, G P - 1877 - sailed 1913 - Liverpool to Ghana, (Gold Coast) Accra.
BARGERY, G P - 1877 - " " 1916 - Liverpool to West Coast of Africa.
BARGERY, G P - 1877 - " " 1918 - Liverpool to West Coast of Africa.
BARGERY, C P - 1877 - " " 1921 - Liverpool to Nigeria, Iddo.
BARGERY, G P - 1877 - " " 1923 - Liverpool to Nigeria, Iddo.
BARGERY, G P - 1877 - " " 1924 - Liverpool to Nigeria, Iddo.
BARGERY, G P - 1877 - " " 1926 - Liverpool to Nigeria, Iddo.
BARGERY, G P - 1877 - " " 1929 - Liverpool to Nigeria, Apapa.

There are 32 male Bargery outgoing travellers in the period 1899 to 1930, but the Rev G P is the only one going to Africa.

RE:

I'm not sure where the travelling salesman referrence comes from as I tend to believe he was connected with the medical profession in some way as he travelled to Kampala in Uganda.

The reference comes from Tina's find in the census 10 years after 1901....
There's a Joseph Edward Bargery bn 1872 in Cardiff, listed with recently married wife Helena Jane aged 37yrs, occupation given as Commercial Traveller.

DS