Marriage 24 Feb 1822 St James, Liverpool

Post by **goodie** » 02 Feb 2011 07:34

Can anyone tell me if the ages of the couple getting married is shown in 1822, also parents' names?

Marriage referred to is William Twist & Ann Helsby.

I have hit a gigantic brick wall with trying to find correct parents for William Twist and his correct DOB.

Anyone feel sorry for me and is prepared to help???

Thank you in anticipation.

Maggie

Post by **Tina** » 02 Feb 2011 07:58

Hi Maggie
Are you going around the Twist

When I saw Mount Martha I thought you may be in Qld
Soooo worried about this cyclone due soon there, cat 5

The crew will correct me, I think?? marriage record shows witnesses not father's and says full age being 21 or over.
Katie will let you know if the marriage can be looked up during the refurb of the L.R.O, she's a wonderful helper here.

Have you found Wm in 1841 census at all or 1851?

Tina

Post by **goodie** » 02 Feb 2011 08:18

No, Mount Martha in Victoria. Poor Queensland they have taken a battering over the last couple of months. Very worried about this cyclone though - they say it will be a very big one!!!!

Found Willie Twist on the 1841 Census. His first wife had died in 1837 in West Derby, so his second wife Mary was shown + children. The ages shown on the Census are usually rounded to the nearest number, so cannot find his real DOB.

I just want to know who his parents are - as I have found quite a few and I am very confused. I hope Katie reads this!!!
Kind regards
Maggie

Post by **Hilary** » 02 Feb 2011 08:39

Marriages before 1 July 1837 don't show the couples' fathers or give ages. It may give an occupation, usually says whether bachelor or widower and may say of such and such parish if not of the parish in which the marriage took place.

Hilary
Ed Officer

Post by **MaryA** » 02 Feb 2011 09:36

goodie wrote:Found Willie Twist on the 1841 Census. His first wife had died in 1837 in West Derby, so his second wife Mary was shown + children.

So if first wife died in 1837 did he remarry to Mary after the beginning of Civil Registration - ie July 1837, and "Mary" who?

That is the certificate you will need as hopefully this will show his father's name and occupation.

If the baptism of young Mary is the one in St Mary the Virgin, West Derby, which I suspect it might be - birth 24 Mar 1837 baptism 21 May 1837, then this child must have been the last to his first wife Anne, but I can't see a marriage of a William Twist between that date and 1841.

Do they have any more children after this?

Post by **dickiesam** » 02 Feb 2011 11:09

William may not have married that Mary in the 1841 census until later?

Liverpool marriages...
1843> A William TWIST married one of these spouses:
BLAKELEY, Rachel; HUGHES, Margaret; JONES, Mary?; MASON, Eliza.
Registration District: Liverpool; Year of Registration: 1843 Mar qtr;
Vol: 20; Page: 139.

1846> Or one of these spouses:
ATKINSON, Agnes; JONES, Ann; KELLY, Mary?; MOLYNEUX, Sarah.
Registration District: Liverpool; Year of Registration: 1846 Dec qtr;
Vol: 20; Page; 153.

Dickiesam

Post by **goodie** » 02 Feb 2011 13:27

I don't know which Mary, except that it is shown she was 5yrs older than William if you can accept these ages.

1841:
TWIST, William - 40 - 1801 - Lancashire. Occ: Farrier
TWIST, Mary - 45 - 1796 - Lancashire.
TWIST, Francis - 15 - 1826 - Lancashire.
TWIST, Margaret - 10 - 1831 - Lancashire.
TWIST, Henry - 8 - 1833 - Lancashire.
TWIST, Mary - 4 - 1837 - Lancashire.
Address: Green Lane, Walton On The Hill.
HO107 - Piece: 520 - Book/Folio: 8/53 - Page: 6.

There is a death - Mar 1867
Twist Mary Ann 68 W. Derby 8b 452 - wonder if this is her?

Where would burial records for West Derby be located?

Sorry I couldn't be more helpful.
Kind regards and thank you.
Maggie

Post by **dickiesam** » 02 Feb 2011 16:51

Hi Maggie,
Just a note about ages on the 1841 census pages..

In the 1841 Census a policy of rounding down ages was in place.
As such people aged:
15-19 were recorded as 15;
20-24 were recorded as 20;
25-29 were recorded as 25;
30-34 were recorded as 30;
35-39 were recorded as 35;
Etc....

Children under 15 were to be shown with their correct ages.

When you are searching later censuses for people you have found in the 1841 you need to be aware that they could be 5 years older than shown. So someone the transcription says was born in 1820 could have been born between 1820 and 1825. Then add to that the usual common discrepancies of a couple of years either side....

Dickiesam

Post by **Katie** » 02 Feb 2011 17:55

With no relationship being recorded on the 1841 census Mary could be a sister to William. Have you found any of these Twists on the 1851 census?

Post by **goodie** » 03 Feb 2011 06:23

Here's the daughter MARY TWIST 1861/1871 census'

1861 England Census
about Mary Twist
Name: Mary Twist
Age: 24
Estimated birth year: abt 1837
Relation: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: West Derby, Lancashire, England

1871 CENSUS
Civil Parish: Liverpool
Ecclesiastical parish: Christchurch
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Registration district: Liverpool
Sub-registration district: Islington
ED, institution, or vessel: 18
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 14
Household Members:
Name Age
Agnes Sickett 50
Robt Sickett 47
Sarah F Sickett 22
Mary Twist 24

1871 England Census
about Mary Twist
Name: Mary Twist
Age: 34
Estimated birth year: abt 1837
Relation: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: Fre Brook, West Derby
Civil Parish: Liverpool
Ecclesiastical parish: Christchurch
Town: Liverpool
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Registration district: Liverpool
Sub-registration district: Islington
ED, institution, or vessel: 17
Household schedule number: 11
Household Members:
Name Age
Agnes Berkett 60
Robert Berkett 57
Mary Twist 34 SAME COUPLE

Regards Maggie
PS: Looking for the others.

Post by **goodie** » 03 Feb 2011 06:38

Son - Francis Twist b.chr.17Aug1823 - Marriage+1861+1871 CENSUS

Name: Francis Twist
Gender: Male
Father's Name: William Twist
Spouse's name: Margaret Case
Spouse's Father's Name: Henry Case
Marriage Date: 13 Oct 1844
Marriage Place: Liverpool, Lancashire, England

1861 England Census
about Francis Twist
Name: Francis Twist
Age: 38
Estimated birth year: abt 1823
Relation: Head
Spouse's name: Margaret Twist
Gender: Male
Where born: Liverpool, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: West Derby
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: West Derby
ED, institution, or vessel: 47e
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 53
Household Members:
Name Age
Francis Twist 38
Margaret Twist 37
Joseph Twist 16
Henry Twist 9
Mary E Twist 2

1871 England Census
about Francis Twist
Name: Francis Twist
Age: 48
Estimated birth year: abt 1823
Relation: Head
Gender: Male
Where born: West Derby, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: West Derby
Ecclesiastical parish: Fairfield St John
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: West Derby
ED, institution, or vessel: 57
Household schedule number: 118
Household Members:
Name Age
Francis Twist 48 - NO WIFE
Mary E Twist 13
Margaret Twist 9
Wm Twist 4

Post by **goodie** » 03 Feb 2011 06:47

1851 Census living with Stepmother Margaret - 3rd wife?

Name: Henry Twist
Age: 17
Estimated birth year: abt 1834
Relation: Stepson
Gender: M (Male)
Where born: West Derby, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: West Derby
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: West Derby
ED, institution, or vessel: 1w
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 92
Household Members:
Name Age
Margaret Twist 52 Widow & Pauper Churchwoman - born Wales.
Henry Twist 17

Son Henry Twist m Elizabeth Duke 19 Nov 1856,Holy Trinity Church, Walton-breck, L'shire, England. Immigrated to Australia arriving port of Melbourne 19 Mar 1857 - to start to TWIST CLAN IN AUSTRALIA!!!!

Birth & Immigration details

Name: Henry Twist
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 12 May 1833
Christening Date: 7 Jul 1833
Christening Place: West Derby, Lancashire, England
Age at Christening: 0
Father's Name: William Twist
Mother's Name: Ann

Name: Henry Twist
Estimated birth year: abt 1833
Age: 24
Arrival Date: 19 Mar 1857
Arrival Port: Melbourne, Australia
Departure Port: Liverpool
Ship: Sardinian
Nationality: English

Post by **goodie** » 03 Feb 2011 07:04

Daughter Margaret Twist Chr. 29 Jun 1828

In 1841 Census as already shown.

Cannot find Margaret Twist in 1851 Census.

Death Sept 1846 Margaret Twist, West Derby - is this her??

That's all the children of WILLIAM TWIST/ANN HELSBY as far as I know.

Please let me know if I can help in any other way. Just need to know parents of WILLIAM TWIST who married ANN HELSBY (now have parents of Ann Helsby).

Really appreciate everyone's interest and trying to help - I certainly need it. Thanks & Regards Maggie

Post by **Tina** » 03 Feb 2011 07:51

Wow Maggie you have been a busy little wombat!!

There's a marriage for William Twist in 1843, one of the brides is a Margaret HUGHES.

Nothing in Lancs BMD sorry.

There are 2 deaths listed for a Wm Twist in W Dby 1847 & 1850.

Not much help today.

Tina

Phew cyclone, no loss of life so far but 3 babies born

.
Cannot believe it will go as far as Mt Isa.
Cairns got off lightly to what they were expecting.
More flooding due. Poor old Cardwell & Tully & Mission Beach.
Mind boggling.

Post by **goodie** » 03 Feb 2011 08:04

Thanks Tina:

I am getting so frustrated at not having William's correct father!! I have looked and looked.

What I found in my searchings is the death of an ANN TWIST, buried 16 July 1837, aged 88, dob 1749, Walton on the Hill. Wondering if this is William Twist's mother!!!!

Maggie

Yes, I couldn't sleep last night worrying about the cyclone hitting!! So pleased when I awoke this morning to find no loss of life!! (as yet). Anna Bligh (Premier) has been fantastic - some of our other leaders should follow suit!!!! - but then she's a woman!!!

Post by **Tina** » 04 Feb 2011 08:41

Hi Maggie
Anna has a good surname BLIGH!!

There are a few baptisms in the Huyton area.
It's so hard to pinpoint.

I think the Ann Twist you found would have been over the hill to be Williams Mum.
soz not much help.

Tina

Post by **goodie** » 08 Feb 2011 06:50

Looking for marriage of a JAMES TWIST & ELIZABETH SWIFT. Son WILLIAM TWIST Chr. 5 Feb 1797 St Nicholas, Liverpool, as was the daughter ANN TWIST.

Can anyone help in my search? Hope so, need all the help I can get!

Maggie

Post by **goodie** » 11 Feb 2011 07:58

Can anyone tell me how I can locate MI's (Monumental Inscriptions) for Liverpool?

In my search for TWIST's this is the only way I can think of to try to find them?

Hope someone can help? Thank you.
Maggie

Post by **MaryA** » 11 Feb 2011 10:31

There is no one central collection for MI's so we have tried to put together a collection of links.

http://liverpool-genealogy.org.uk/phpBB ... php?t=5739

For searching online for old burials, it's well worth taking the trouble to go through the numerous links on the old-merseytimes site.

Post by **Katie** » 11 Feb 2011 17:03

Here is the marriage of a William Twist to a Margaret Hughes

15th January 1843 St Peter's Church Street

William Twist of full age Widower Labourer Finch Street-Father William Twist Labourer.

Margaret Hughes Full age Spinster-Dance Street? Hugh Hughes- Stone Mason.

William x Twist
Margaret x Hughes
Witnesses: William Twist
Margaret x Roberts

The marriage in St James will not record ages or parents of those getting married.

Assuming that the marriage in 1843 is the correct one You William Twists father is William Twist.

Liverpool & South West Lancashire FHS - Forum