Alfred Vernon Stanley born 1880

[julielake]

We have some more info... yes Alfred did change his name. He did attend a grammar school in England. He left England for South Africa to work in the diamond mines prior to the second Boer War. He fought in the Boer War - I don't know which side (would he have to be naturalised in Sth Africa to fight for them?) and then traveled to Australia straight from South Africa. I don't know what shipping routes existed then. Apparently he could not return to England.

Wondering if his knowledge of places like Knowsley, Lancashire and Preston Grammar mean that he had a local knowledge of the area??

[MaryA]

I think it unlikely that he would have needed to go through a naturalisation process, it is quite likely that if a man wanted to sign up to fight he would have been grabbed.

So there's no suggestions as to what he changed his name from?

He could have been anywhere in Lancashire, which is the county covering a large area, including Knowsley and Preston which are not on each other's doorsteps. I wonder if he heard stories about the renowned Stanley family of Knowsley, and linked himself to them for prestige.

[dickiesam]

Unfortunately, now we know he changed his name [whether forenames, surnames or both] finding any trace of him in England will be nigh on impossible. He may have also changed his DoB. If he only changed his surname there are 92 Alfreds listed leaving the UK as passengers bound for South Africa between 1898 and 1901.

[Alison C]

If he changed his name and could not return to England then it looks like he may have been involved in some sort of trouble before he left England. Perhaps it was reported in the local newspapers? Though without knowing his name this might prove difficult to find!!

[dickiesam]

He left England for South Africa to work in the diamond mines prior to the second Boer War. He fought in the Boer War - I don't know which side (would he have to be naturalised in Sth Africa to fight for them?) and then traveled to Australia straight from South Africa. I don't know what shipping routes existed then. Apparently he could not return to England.

I agree with MaryA in that 'naturalisation' as such did not exist in South Africa at that time. As he was a British subject it is unlikely he would have fought with the Boers against the British Army. Had he been caught he would probably have been shot as a traitor.

As for shipping routes many coastal towns would have had shipping links especially major ports such as Durban and Capetown. Vessels on route to Australia would have called to such ports on a regular basis for supplies and fresh water, as well as 'delivering' passengers and embarking more, etc.

Can anything be found as to where Alfred might have been before he married, especially as he appears to have arrived at a port in Australia between 1902 and 1915 when he married? I feel that is an area you should concentrate on. For instance, where was he in the 1911 Australian Census? And have you searched early Australian voting registers?

[julielake]

There is no Australian census data for 1911, the earliest record I have of a confirmed Alfred Vernon Stanley is on the 1914 Australian electoral roll. After that he appears regularly in Australian records.

There are 2 Alfred Stanley's who arrived in Australia according to the shipping records for both ships the Alfred Stanley's mentioned embarked in Liverpool.

I am visiting my great aunt's in the coming month so hope that sitting and talking and looking at what info, photos, mementos etc they have may prompt some memories and give me some more clues.

[MaryA]

http://home.id.com.au/public-resources/ ... nsus-1911/

[julielake]

Unfortunately that's only statistical data Mary There's no personal details in it

[MaryA]

That's a shame.

Have you tried Rate and valuation Books? https://familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/ ... a_Taxation or Directories https://familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/ ... irectories

[dickiesam]

Unfortunately that's only statistical data Mary There's no personal details in it

Have you contacted the Bureau of Statistics regarding searching the actual census record for an individual and if the 1911 census summaries still exist?

info@id.com.au
10 Easey street, PO Box 1689
Collingwood VIC 3066
Australia

[MaryA]

Sadly DS, it would appear that all the important stuff was destroyed
https://familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/Australia_Census

[dickiesam]

Sadly DS, it would appear that all the important stuff was destroyed
https://familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/Australia_Census

Oh BH! So much for bureaucracy!

[louis]

Hi Julie

http://www.casus-belli.co.uk has a database of men and women who served in the British Imperial Forces during the Anglo-Boer War 1899-1902. Registration and credits are required to view detailed records.

Louis

[Gray]

Hi Julie,

Like many I have been following and trying to make some headway with your Alfred.

I do feel that he certainly knew something of Knowsley, unless you know or have heard of the area Knowsley it would not slip off the tongue easily.
I also wonder when you mention Preston was this possibly Prescot?

I have been playing for days but keep coming back to this family for numerous reasons. I maybe way off the mark, nothing ventured. Nothing with the names you have posted, who knows? Certainly nothing for Ivy but there are family members who have a sister Eveline? possible IVY?
I apologize if I am off beam but all avenues need to be explored ))

The family I am looking at is: Reichardt, of German origin,a well known family in the Knowsley area but because of the situation WW1 changed their name to Richardson. Can be found Knowsley history.
http://history.knowsley.gov.uk/show_pho ... &search=72

Alfred Reichardt Prescot june 1881 8b 654

father: frederick Charles Reichardt
mother: Ellen Swift Tyrer

marriage: Liverpool june 1877 8b 197

1881 census: RG11 Piece:3727 Folio 48 pg 6
address: Bradley Hotel Widnes Lancashire

Fredk Reichardt 1857 born Liverpool occ: publican
Ellen S 1854 Knowsley Lancashire
George P 1880 Widnes lancashire
Fredk 1881 Widnes lancashire

1891 census: RG12 Piece 3013 Folio 66 pg 3
address: Bradley Hotel Albert street Widnes Lancashire
Ellen widow 1854 Lancashire (was actually born Knowsley)
George P 1880 Lancashire
Alfred 1881 Lancashire

1901 Censu: RG13 Piece 3514 folio 20 pg. 32
address: 3 midland street Widnes lancashire

Ellen Reichardt widow aged 46 born Knowsley lancashire
George P 21 occ: fitters labourer bor Widnes Lancs
Alfred 20 occ: app iron moulder born widnes


1911 census:

George Reichardt can be found in Kent married with family

No Ellen or Alfred found..

p.s there was a Alfred Ernest Reichard born Prescott sept 1877 8b 618 but sadly he died
Alfred E west derby sept 1908 8b 372

I wish you every success with your search!

Gray

[simone]

Hi Gray

I've had a good play with the Reichardts too (saw some as Richards )..they are so close but just don't quite fit do they
I've followed the kiddies and saw the death you found, but there is an Alfred in New York passengers lists, but I can't see the record but he may be the one born Germany 1877 married to Ana...


Frustrating

Simone xx

[Alison C]

Lancashire OPC has a marriage for Alfred Reichardt, father Frederick (publican) to Ann Barnes in 1910:

Marriage: 22 Jan 1910 St Paul, Peel, Little Hulton, Lancashire, England
Alfred Reichardt - 29, Moulder, Bachelor, 84 Cleggs Lane
Ann Barnes - 25, Weaver, Spinster, 76 Cleggs Lane
Groom's Father: Frederick Reichardt, Deceased, Publican
Bride's Father: James Barnes, Stone miner
Witness: Levi Barnes; Ellen Barnes; James Barnes

[Gray]

Oh dear Alison.. another theory bites the dust.

In the 1910+1 he is living with his in-laws at 76 Cleggs Lane Little Hulton Near Bolton occ: iron moulder

Just for the record Simone

A Reichardt Mr Single (travelling alone)
departure year - 1908
Destination: New York
Ship's Name: Baltic
Departed: Liverpool

No other details listed

Wonder if this is the chap above?

This is a challenge but haven't a clue now

Gray

[simone]

I was wondering about the witnesses at marriage.. One is a James Joel Gale...possibilities for him... was hoping he went over with him.... but can't get a grip on anything definite...
Nothing for Cecelia, so take it she deffo Australian?

[julielake]

The witness to their marriage appears to be Australian.

My great aunt (the older of the two) says Alfred was sent away from England for something he shouldn't have done. He went to Sth Africa to work in the diamond mines (not sure if family sent him there or this is where he chose). My mum recalls knowing lots about diamond mining and De Beers when she was a child (she is mid 70's now) and Alfred told her the acid from the mines had damaged his fingernails. He fought for the Boers and was told also to get out of Sth Africa when the war ended (my great aunt was muddling thing up a little by this stage so not sure if this bit is right) and from there he headed to Australia.

Alfred was a very avid reader and a good one. He rose early at 5am and went to bed at 5pm. The older of my great aunt doesn't recall anything about a grammar school.