Cold case - my Grandmother

Post by **Hilary** » 08 Nov 2009 20:51

You most definitely may. Mary

Do you think it matters that George Jones is deceased and doesn't show on the certificate?

Perhaps Elizabeth as the cashier took the money from John Dobson, he was an insurance clerk later to be a fire assessor for the Royal Insurance, at lunch time and they gazed into each other's eyes and that was it!

Por John was a widow he had 2 sons one died, then his wife died and then the second son died. he married Elizabeth and they had a son who died aged 3 hours, then a daughter who lived, then another daughter who died very very young, then a son who lived, then another daughter who died aged 4 then my mother who obviously lived. All a bit sad really.

Hilary
Ed Officer

PS I wonder if mary the wife and MAry Jane are in the 1911 census? they should be.

Post by **MaryA** » 08 Nov 2009 20:53

Huh that's how grateful she is - wants us to do more work!!!

Post by **Daisycakes** » 08 Nov 2009 20:56

MaryA wrote:Huh that's how grateful she is - wants us to do more work!!!

Very subtle

Ann

Post by **MaryA** » 08 Nov 2009 21:03

Just in case they were still at 15 Cupid Street I checked to see - strangely enough there is a 19 year old Edward Jones living there but with Daniel Noble 63, Betsey Noble 61 and Catherine Tallon 25. Do these names mean anything to you?

Post by **Hilary** » 08 Nov 2009 21:09

No didn't mean you lot to look I'll look. I was just trying to understand Cheshire Parish Regsiters projects and failed miserably.

I'm on my knees grovelling. You're all geniuses or should it be genii? So do you think we've found them?

I've sent Mary photos of the lady maybe she can load them onto here for you to look at my grandmother. I hope she also assures you I haven't got a nose like her.

Hilary

Ed Officer

PS None of those names mean anything to me sorry!

Post by **MaryA** » 08 Nov 2009 21:21

Well it was worth a thought. Cheek of it, she even gets me to do her dirty work rather than reading the instructions about posting a piccie

Yes she does look just like her granny

Judging by the noses I reckon you are right that they are sisters, and the age gap seems right too.

Post by **MaryA** » 08 Nov 2009 21:24

Celebrating with a bag of choccie raisins - Tina's going to be gutted that we solved a Cold Case while she was sleeping

Post by **Hilary** » 08 Nov 2009 21:36

Cheek my nose isn't a bit like hers honest!

Well I've done a bit of digging and I've come up with this from the IGI
all at St Peters Liverpool obviously I need to check them out for addresses and occupation but what do you think?

Mary Jane Jones bn 26 October 1858 ch 27 Dec 1858
Hannah Jones bn 20 dec 1860 ch 14 Jan 1861
William Jones bn 21 May 1867 ch 10 june 1867
Elizabeth Sarah Jones bn 21 Sept 1870 ch 26 Dec 1870

all children of George and Mary

and Elizabeth's brith date ties in with her death date and maybe she added a year to her age as John was much older.

Can't find a death for George so maybe he'd run off!

You're all wonderful

I haven't got a big nose but I do knit with the wool in my right hand just like my grandmother Elizabeth Jones.

Post by **MaryA** » 08 Nov 2009 21:53

Sounds good to me!

Don't everybody have the wool in their right hand?

Post by **Hilary** » 08 Nov 2009 22:05

Actually got that all wrong what I meant to say was that I don't knit like my grandmother. I knit as my mother taught me with the wool in my left hand. She said it was because she was taught to knit by a Frenchwoman not her mother.

I'm fascinated when I go to the Swiss Open Air Museum at Ballenberg to see people knitting like me!

Do you think I can say we've cracked it? I don't want to get too excited and then someone say don't be daft it's wrong. I really like it though I shan't sleep plotting when I can get down to Liverpool maybe the week after next.

Hilary
Ed Offcier

Post by **Hilary** » 08 Nov 2009 22:36

I think this could be George and Mary's marriage

george Jones to Mary Dillon 29 September 1857 at St Nicholas

On lancashirebmd Mary is given as Dillon and Reed as if she's been married before.

You'll all have to wait till I've been to liverpool to do some looking up to hear the next bit of the saga.

Many many thanks you're all genii

Hilary
Ed Officer

Post by **MaryA** » 09 Nov 2009 09:33

When something comes together I often feel you get a gut reaction or not and in this case I felt we had, especially when both Elizabeth and Mary J were together in the 1901 census, it made sense that Mary J would be the witness to her marriage when she was the only sibling left at home. The age is right too isn't it, give or take a year or so, which we always expect.

My only wonder is why the Wirral for their marriage, but would that be explained by where the hubby lived, or even where they lived themselves after their marriage for a while?

Do you have mother's death? it might complicate things, giving you an additional area to search for it.

Post by **MaryA** » 09 Nov 2009 09:34

Education Officer wrote:george Jones to Mary Dillon 29 September 1857 at St Nicholas

On lancashirebmd Mary is given as Dillon and Reed as if she's been married before.

At least being after Civil Registration the father's name will be given so clearing up what her maiden name was.

Post by **Daisycakes** » 09 Nov 2009 09:44

Hi well done Mary isnt it just the best when something comes together...Hilary wasnt it excitin!!!!

Ann

Post by **Hilary** » 09 Nov 2009 09:52

Hi everyone who solved my cold case

It was so exciting - and I managed to sleep.
Mary - I think they just married in Wallsey as that was where they were to live. John in 1901 is at 112 Belmont Road Walton on the Hill (I think it's Anfield area). He worked for Royal Insurance and they definitely lived at the address they married from and then in Wallasey road before moving to 8 Greenhill Ave Allerton were my mother was born. I reckon maybe he was sent over the water with the firm. As Elizabeth is a lodger in 1901 maybe there was no affiliation to a church there.

I did find a possibly death for Mary Jones the mother in March Q of 1901 so maybe Elizabeth and Mary J were just a bit adrift.

My only bit of a worry after funding the baptisms was that Elizabeth Sarah (which they never seem to use) I hope I don't suddenly find a marriage for her.

I've even got some other Jones' family to look for.

Thanks Mary and Ann and everyone else. I'll let you know what else I find.

Hilary
Ed Officer

Post by **erika** » 09 Nov 2009 10:51

Congrats to you all for solving the case.
Visitors turned up just as I'd found the 1881 entry, so by the time I got back to look everything was done and dusted

I'll just stick to my directories in future, you lot are far too quick

If anyone needs lookups just ask.

Cheers
Erika

Post by **MaryA** » 09 Nov 2009 11:21

And very well done to you too Ann, the most important part is the initial find then everything else falls into place afterwards.

Erika, we are always grateful for your directories, couldn't get anywhere without them.

Ed Off - Belmont Road is the street where Newsham is, as in where the West Derby Workhouse was, later to become Newsham General Hospital. The other houses in the street were quite large I believe. (can't remember what number the workhouse was but not 112 I don't think anyway)

Post by **Daisycakes** » 09 Nov 2009 11:36

Number 42 Belmont road was part of the hospital ((my other grandmother died there)) Your right Mary the houses where large Victorian I seem to remember from my schooldays at St Margarets back in 1949. ((showing my age now))

Ann

Post by **Hilary** » 11 Nov 2009 16:08

I've been to the Record Office today. The baptisms are all the children of the boiler maker so I'm going to try and sort out a birth certifiicate for one of the children to send for.

The marriage of George Jones to Mary Dillon was not right. I tried anouther at St peters in 1856 George Jones to mary Munford but that didn't seem right as george was given as a plasterer. I couldn't see a plasterer suddenly becoming a boilermaker by 1858.

Still I've got a birth date I reckon for my Elizabeth Jonws my elusive grandmother.

Hilary
Ed officer

Post by **MaryA** » 12 Nov 2009 11:22

Shame about the marriage, but at least if you have an accurate birth date with a bit of luck you will get the mother's surname - fingers crossed!