Rice Hughes carpenter and Mariner 1841

Post by **kwr** » 10 Jun 2011 14:59

John Price Hughes married L'pool St John 1842 Gentleman! I'll have to wait for his will...J

Post by **simone** » 10 Jun 2011 16:06

simone wrote:IGI

also on same batch no

John Rigby Hughes son of Robert Price Hughes and Ann Elizabeth, baptism
12 May 1844

Robert and Ann married at St John, Liverpool Sep q 1842

may be worth a look up to see if any connection to Reece/Rice

Simone x

Robert and Ann too... same year.. wonder if same day

Post by **Hilary** » 10 Jun 2011 16:40

Don't forget to check out Hughes marriages in Runcorn. There are a number on www.cheshirebmd.org.uk

Post by **kwr** » 10 Jun 2011 17:22

Yes Simone, Hugh Hughes bapt 1844 son of Rees and Elizabeth, married Ellen Ravenscroft by Lic 1866 d/o Ralph Ravenscroft and Sarah (Bolton I hope, I'm expecting to get M Cert tomorrow), confusingly Ralph was s/o James Ravencroftand Sarah (Kirkham, I think) Sarah Snr has her grandchildren with her in 1851, what a red herring that was!)
Their dau Ellen is my mate's grandmother. (I'm doing it for others now because apart from my gt grandfather brickwall in Marylebone, there isn't much more of my tree I can grow. Travelling all over the country to County Records would put the leaves on my tree but it's time consuming and expensive in overnight stays.) I think that answers you, I'll go back to check your last posting to see.
I'll check out the CheshireBMDs, Ed Officer.
I'll be back with any finds. J

Post by **simone** » 10 Jun 2011 21:28

kwr wrote:John Price Hughes married L'pool St John 1842 Gentleman! I'll have to wait for his will...J

think you meant Robert

not sure where I'm goin but found this.. probably won't make a difference except to keep on back burner for now.

note Edward Price Hughes is father.. then this on IGI,

John Price Hughes b 19 Jan 1828.. died 11 Jan 1906 Te Puke, Auckland, New Zealand
parents Hugh Price Hughes and Miriam Roberts according to submitted entry, don't know where they got that info from..
Hugh and Miriam Roberts married 17 Sep 1825 both extracted and submitted entries. at St Michael Toxteth...
Hugh died in 1840.. Miriam married Robert Parry also a widow on 24/3/1841, at St Augustine, Walton on theHill, her father Richard Roberts, ship chandler, his father John Parry farmer,
witnessed by Edward Price Hughes and John Parry
this marriage is on Ancestry

Hugh and Edward brothers

Simone x

Post by **simone** » 11 Jun 2011 11:06

Don't you think at first glance that the name Price on the marriage cert looks like Rice

Post by **kwr** » 11 Jun 2011 11:18

I don't think a gentleman has much place in this family!
I am now convinced that although Hugh Huges shows up twice in 2 different censuses (1851, 1901), he is actually the same person. I have come across another case where workplace and home both entered a person as in this case in 1901 and KWR has the same person entered by 2 diifferent relatives (in his case, in the same house!) as we seem to have here, with mother and stepfather, and with uncle and aunt round the corner, in 1851.
Have you any views on the Ormison relationship? Do you think it is to the Duttons or the Hughes? or the Evans? I can't catch hold of any other link yetWaiting for the post! J

Post by **simone** » 11 Jun 2011 12:37

yes i have someone in 2 household's too

suppose it depeneds what day the enumerator got to each house

is that how it worked then

they are all in close proximity to each other in 1851..

the Hill's who married and Jospeh witnessed at marriage are in the area too.

tried to work out Ormson relationship, can't see anything obvious

have tried to see if Elizabeth's sister Mary Ann Dutton who is on 1851 census with them led anywhere too but no luck yet.

we'll see waht the post man brings

Simone x

Post by **kwr** » 11 Jun 2011 14:22

' "Oh help and Bother", said Pooh.'
1) Well 5 Oct 1846
Ralph Ravenscroft f/a Bach Mariner of Frodsham s/o James Ravenscroft deceased
to
Sarah Bolton f/a Spinster of Frodsham d/o William Bolton Deceased
Witnesses (difficult to read but looks like) Enoch Houghesand Elizabeth Bailey.
Enoch Hughes? who the H is he?
2) Feb 23 1851 Parish Church Dansbury Elizabeth Hughes f/a Widow of Higher Runcorn d/o William Dutton Waterman
to John Hignet Rogers farmer. wits James Johnson, Jane Rogers

Post by **Hilary** » 11 Jun 2011 15:28

The marriage of John Hignet Rogers to Elizabeth Hughes nee Dutton was at Daresbury All Saints. It's just a little way outside Runcorn.

Who are the Ravenscrofts?

Post by **simone** » 11 Jun 2011 15:47

Hi Hilary

Ellen Ravenscroft married Hugh Hughes, son of Rice/Reece.. her parents were Ralph and Sarah

Post by **simone** » 11 Jun 2011 17:31

What about Enoch possibly your welsh link

try this one in hospital in Chester

1851- HO107; Piece: 2172; Folio: 295; Page: 8
Enoch Hughes 44, patient b Llanstffraid, Joiner
would it be the norm to go to Chester hospital from Denbighshire or has he been with realtives in Cheshire and ended up there

1851 no Enoch at Home

at Llanstffraid
HO107; Piece: 2519; Folio: 305; Page: 21
Elinor Hughes 44 married b Llanstffraid Joiner's wife
Elinor Hughes 10
Mary Hughes 9
Margret Hughes 7
Edward Hughes 5

1841 in Wales
ho107 20 6 5
Enoch Hughes 30 joiner
Ellinor Hughes 30
Ellis Hughes 9
Joseph Hughes 7
Sarah Hughes 3
Ellin Hughes 1

he is back home in 1861
RG9; Piece: 4358; Folio: 94; Page: 28

other Hughes family as neighbours.

home in 1871
RG10; Piece: 5738; Folio: 91; Page: 16
will play around with him for a while

1881 with daughter still in Wales
RG11; Piece: 5582; Folio: 82; Page: 12
William Evans 40 farmer
Sarah Evans 43
Margaret E. Evans 12
William H. Evans 11
Mary Evans 8
Enoch Hughes 74 father in law, Joiner
Elizabeth Williams 64t servan

maybe he's a red herring

got to go out for a bit

Simone x

Post by **kwr** » 11 Jun 2011 18:09

Enoch Houghes might be a red herring, but it would be a coincidence (?) to drag this herring off the street to witness the wedding of Ralph Ravenscroft to Sarah Bolton whose daghter married Hugh Hughes..
The Hugh Hughes sawyer neighbour of Joseph Ormerod was born in Wales as well. Too many Welshmen!
Unless the Wills turn up something, I think we've probably had this one - or a Robert, Hugh or Ann Hughes wedding with sibling witnesses for confirmation.
I'll let you know what the Wills say. It's the least I can do after all your efforts!
Hilary, I looked at Runcorn BMDs and found another Hugh Hughes wedding in 1858 - another red herring. There was also a Robert Hughes married to Mary Edgeley which I must follow up - 1845

Post by **simone** » 11 Jun 2011 20:43

Hi re the Ormison/Ormson/ Hughes link - there is a marriage on Cheshire Bmd for 1846 Thomas Ormison to Mary Dutton at Davenham, St Wilfred.

there is a Thomas and Mary b 1827 & c 1823 at Witton near Davenham

in 1851 they are at Witton
HO107; Piece: 2165; Folio: 313; Page: 8
transcribed as Crmson ( I have done correction on Anc)
they have John Southerton and Sarah with them.
Sarah and Mary possibly sisters
marriage John Southerton and Sarah Dutton married in 1850 at Gt Budworth.
Unfortunately looks like Sarah is on her own in 1841, although there is a family on the opposite page that she could belong to.
HO107; Piece 120; Book: 12 Folio: 4; Page: 3

not sure if connected to your Elizabeth.. or if Thomas connected to Joseph and Catherine Ormson

hope the wills prove fruitful

like you say too many people with smae names

Simone x

Post by **simone** » 12 Jun 2011 15:16

simone wrote:IGI

Hugh Hughes bapt 29 Dec 1844 at Runcorn. extracted record
parents Reece Hughes and Elizabeth

also on same batch no

John Rigby Hughes son of Robert Price Hughes and Ann Elizabeth, baptism
12 May 1844

I think they are living with Rigby in laws in 1851 at Mersey Street, Runcorn
Robert is a Ship Broker?
HO107; Piece: 2164; Folio: 405 transcribed as Robert S Price

no sign of baby John.. so maybe he has died.

Robert and Ann married at St John, Liverpool Sep q 1842

may be worth a look up to see if any connection to Reece/Rice

their daughter Annie Louise Hughesb c 1848 is staying with her grandfather John Rigby back in Liverpool in 1861..RG9; Piece: 2597; Folio: 76; Page: 9

no sign of mum and dad...there is an Ann Hughes married, Mariner's wife...but husband absent. at Bostock Street Liverpool in 1861, RG9; Piece: 2651; Folio: 112; Page: 51...could Robert be the one aboard ship in 1861 with young Hugh only thing is this Ann says born Liverpool not Cheshire

Sorry no idea if any of this will fit obviously... just a few ideas to look at hope I'm not wasting your time

Simone x

another daughter

Hannah Jane Hughes
Birth Date: abt 1846
Christening Date: 8 Mar 1846
Christening Place: Runcorn, Cheshire, England
Father's name: Robert Price Hughes
Mother's name: Anne Hughes

but
Dec q 1853 Death Runcorn
Robert Price Hughes

so he can't be the Robert aboard ship in 1861

on Ches BMD also -1853

HUGHES Robert Price age 36 Runcorn
Halton
RUN/9/67

Post by **simone** » 12 Jun 2011 15:41

possible death for Hannah at Runcorn age 2, 1847

on Cheshire Bmd

also

wonder if this is Hugh Hughes b c 1820, brother to Rice/Reece
death 1844
HUGHES Hugh age 24 Runcorn Halton RUN/4/24

Simone x

Post by **kwr** » 12 Jun 2011 16:02

Well Simone, I think I'm going to have to investigate these Robert Price lot in Runcorn and Hugh's death. I may even have to charge my mate for the odd certificate! Thanks a lot for pursuing it.
I'm off to visit my mother now, (92 dementia, all available memories picked clean before - though it's really odd what is still floating up out of memories that I have never heard before in my life like spending a summer in the Wompah hotel in Folkstone in the '20s where her mother got a job for herself and one for their maid...I Googled it and it exists though not spelled like that), in fact it fills a whole block!)

Post by **Hilary** » 12 Jun 2011 18:12

There is someone on cheshire roots chat also investigating Hugh the son of Rice.

I don't know how to put a link to save duplication

Post by **simone** » 12 Jun 2011 18:27

kwr wrote:Thank you all for looking at this for me (I am not KWR but his wife - JR

this one Hilary
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.ph ... 985.0.html

is it you JR on Rootschat?

If it is Hugh's death wouldn't it be ideal if Hugh had married before death in 1843 and his wife was informant

probably no such luck though

Simone x

Post by **simone** » 12 Jun 2011 20:46

This may be a long shot

but if you could get a lookup on this marriage from Cheshire Bmd
1842 sep q
HUGHES Hannah
JONES Robert
Runcorn, All Saints
Halton

I wonder if it could be Ann

funny thing is on Free Bmd & Ancestry marriage she is listed as Ann Hugh

I've looked for possible persons on 1841 census and found this Robert Jones.. Waterman, at Fryer Street
HO107; Piece 95; Book: 20 District: 7; Folio: 14; Page: 23
he is age 15 like Ann is 15 on 1841, but would have been rounded down

as you know Ann is here, Wellington Street
HO107; Piece 95; Book: 20 District: 7; Folio:5 page 4
they are both in the same district.. just a few flicks of the page away from each other.. she's on folio 5, he's on 14.
In fact according to google maps they are a 4 minute walk away from each other

http://bit.ly/mhCIVm

can't see another Hannah Hughes to fit

think I've exausted all the options now

Simone x