James Cooper

[dickiesam]

Re:

James Cooper born in Edinborough 1810 married to Margaret (nee Welsh) born in Ireland 1823. The family lived in and around Liverpool during these years.

Hi Val, from the above I gather that their marriage was in Liverpool between 1837 and 1853? However, I haven't yet found a James Cooper + Margaret Welsh match. Welsh is an unusual name hereabouts.... wondering if it should be Walsh?

[Bertieone]

DS,

1856,
Cooper James Liverpool 8b 89
Welsh Margaret Liverpool 8b 89


Name:
James Cooper
Widowed
Marriage
23 Mar 1856
Marriage
Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Fathers
Thomas Cooper, Robert Welsh
Margaret Welsh

[dickiesam]

DS,
1856,
Cooper James Liverpool 8b 89
Welsh Margaret Liverpool 8b 89

Name:
James Cooper
Widowed
Marriage
23 Mar 1856
Marriage
Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Fathers
Thomas Cooper, Robert Welsh
Margaret Welsh

Hi Bert,
Thanks for the nudge! I had mistakenly assumed Margaret was James' first wife and mother of the daughter Elizabeth and married when she was 16 or so, around 1839, or later. Clearly not thinking outside the box today!

As a consolation I found these..
Baptism: 7 Dec 1856 St Peter, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Jessie Cooper - [Child] of James Cooper & Margaret
Abode: Leece St
Occupation: Hairdresser
Baptised by: W. R. Duncan Curate
Register: Baptisms 1856 - 1857, Page 139, Entry 1109

Baptism: 29 Aug 1858 St Peter, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Margaretta Cooper - [Child] of James Cooper & Margaret
Born: 30 Jun 1858
Abode: Leece St.
Occupation: Hair Dresser
Baptised by: W. R. Duncan, Curate
Register: Baptisms 1858, Page 381, Entry 3043

Baptism: 5 Apr 1863 St Peter, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
James Robert Cooper - [Child] of James Cooper & Margaret
Born: 31 Jan 1863
Abode: Leece St
Occupation: Hair Dresser
Baptised by: W. R. Duncan, Curate
Register: Baptisms 1862 - 1863, Page 266, Entry 2124

Didn't find a baptism for Elizabeth Cooper though, so am wondering if she really was in fact born in Liverpool.

[Bertieone]

Previous marriage,

[dickiesam]

Previous marriage

So James was a widower twice over! And unless Ann Brodie had previously married a Brodie she had reverted to her maiden name for that marriage? Her father's name is James Brodie.

If my assumption regarding Elizabeth's birth as being Dec qtr of 1853 then the final one of these deaths could be her mother?
Deaths Mar 1850: COOPER, Ann - Liverpool 20 282
Deaths Mar 1852: Cooper, Ann - Liverpool 8b 175
Deaths Mar 1854: Cooper, Ann - Liverpool 8b 117

This looks like the Cooper family in 1851....
HO107 Piece 2182 Folio 48 Page 24
Address: 5 Leece Street, Liverpool.
James Cooper Head 47 1804 Hair Dresser - Scotland
Ann Cooper Wife 47 1804 Cook - Scotland
Agnes Stewart Servant Widow 37 1814 House Servant - Scotland

In 1851 #9 Leece Street was the home of Edwin Eckford [25], shipbroker's clerk.

Note: James seems to have lost a few years when he married Margaret Welsh!

[dickiesam]

And this might be Ann Brodie..
Birth/Baptism: 14/07/1806 - BRODIE, ANNE - parents: JAMES BRODIE and CHRISTIAN FLOCKHART - Parish of BENHOLM in KINCARDINE - ScotsGRO ref 253/00 0020 0193

[cooper+12345]

Hi Mary, Bert and DS, Today I received my first copy of Liverpool Family Historian and looking forward very much to reading it. I am sorry I have been a bit lax replying to each of you but it has been a busy week and now the grandchildren are on half term. I promise you all though, I will get round to writing to each of you as soon as I can, I am very grateful that you have all shown so much interest. This Saturday I will be off to Upminster to the East of London Family History Society to which I am also a member. I know they will be interested to hear all about the Liverpool FHS. We meet once a month on a Saturday it's a day long meeting to which non members are welcome to come along to hear the speakers, the meeting are always well supported. This week our two speakers will be talking about 'Irish Family History Resources on the Internet' and after lunch 'Men of Bad Character' wage decline in farming 19c. should be interesting. I will close for now I hear my husband rattling the cups, so I think a cup of tea is called for. Don't think I have forgotten you if you don't hear from me for a couple of weeks I promise I will be in touch. Val.

[MaryA]

Good to hear you enjoy FH meetings, if ever you are in Liverpool I hope you will come to one of ours also.

[cooper+12345]

Hi folk, I hope you all had a good Easter. Well I am back on the computer and checking out all the information and advise you sent to me. I can definitely say now that James Cooper died 7th September 1904 aged 95, Senile Decay and Heart failure, formally an Umbrella Manufacturer his son James Robert was with him when he died. So he was a Manufacturer and not just a worker. Did he make walking sticks as well the newspaper cutting that Bert sent to me seems to confirm that he did. Do any of you know if there is a difference between an Umbrella Maker and an Umbrella dresser I wonder if he only made the frames I will keep digging and hope I find out one day. It does seem strange that James left the business to his two Spinster daughters and not to his son perhaps he wanted to be sure his daughters could maintain their independence and this was a way of doing it. I have only come across one Probate for a James Cooper at the moment and unfortunately it wasn't the right one. I have checked out the dates of the death of James Robert and have come to the same conclusion as yourselves, died January 1917 aged 88. His wife Martha died June 1935 aged 70 I have just sent for their Death Certificates. Elizabeth is a bit of a mystery but I have sent for her birth certificate, I have gone for March 1851, West Derby and keeping my fingers crossed it is the right one. I believe Elizabeth is the daughter of James and his second wife Ann. I have a Marriage Certificate for James and Margaret Welsh dated 23rd March 1856 he was a widower she a Spinster, Elizabeth was born in 1851 so couldn't be the daughter of James and Margaret. James father was a cabinet maker and Margaret's father Robert Welsh a Pensioner. I know Jessie Cooper married a William Wilcock, Company Sergeant Major, 2nd Highland Light Infantry I don't have a date for the marriage but they did have at least one son Jack. Bert how did you find the Marriage Certificate for James and Ann Brodie, could you possibly send it again I can only see part of it. I read in the Family Tree Magazine the Deregulation Bill has now been passed all stages in the Commons and the Lords but the final form of the bill is yet to be agreed. Should this go ahead, it will allow for the publication of information from birth, marriage and death certificates on England and Wales to be issued in a form other than a certified copy. This could mean an end to expensive certificates for family history purposes. Hooray, I do hope so but you may already be aware of this. Well folk that's all for now. I have a long way to go still but thanks to all you good folk I have had a good head start. Thank you. Val.

[Bertieone]

Hi Val,

The marriage is on Ancestry, if you subscribe, the link should work for you,

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/2197/ ... turnRecord

The image below is all there is.

[Bertieone]

Val,

According to a tree on Anc, William Willcock & Jessie Cooper had a girl, Frances Doreen Wilcock, born 1916, Edinburgh. There is 1 hit on Scotlands People for Frances. She went on to marry, Alfred R Cunningham, 1937, Liverpool, 8b 253.