Anyone help with C.A.C and David Johnson please.

[happymanoftheworld]

Hi - I have inherited an 18 carat gold Hunter via my Gt. Aunt. It was presented to her husband Dave who I only knew briefly when I was a child. I know that he came from the Liverpool area (married and died in Manchester). I really would love to know at least what the C.A.C stood for and even better if anyone knows the circumstances surrounding the watch. It is particularly of interest because to give such a good watch for only a period of 6 years is quite unusual I would have thought.

The inscription says
Presented to D.Johnson For service rendered 1922-1928 C.A.C

It is very possible from what my dad (93) remembers about Dave that he was involved in athletics (which could be what the A.C (Athletic Club)) stands for. Would also mention that the watch face says Tho. Russell and Son, Liverpool which further suggests a Liverpool connection. Would be grateful for any info or suggestions. Many thanks.

[MaryA]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

I've been racking my brains but could only come up with the suggestion of Childwall perhaps, but there isn't very much available online for the history of any such club, some of our other members might have better ideas. The Liverpool Harriers have apparently deposited some papers at the Record Office coinciding with a centenary in 1982, papers dating from about 1921 which is about the right time, but doesn't really connect with the initial C.

I was wondering whether there might have been any records lodged anywhere from the watchmakers, did you know that there is a specific forum http://www.thewatchforum.co.uk/index.php?act=idx an enthusiast may know the answer to that one.

Another place you may think to search is the newspapers, I know it would be quite difficult to do that on microfilm since even narrowing down your search to the year 1928 would take a long time, but it might be worth checking out Findmypast - available free in the Liverpool library and often some others too. This has newspapers online that you may get a result from even just using the index and then perhaps buying a couple of credits if you think one of the hits might be right.

Still thinking.

[Blue70]

I couldn't find any athletic club references for places in the Liverpool area beginning with 'C' but there is one in the Greater Manchester area that was founded in 1922 called Clayton Harriers:-

http://www.claytonlemoors.org.uk/about/


Blue

[dickiesam]

If you know when and where David Johnson died and where he was living at the time, it might be possible to find an obituary and maybe reports about his death and funeral in a 'local' paper. There could be a mention of the names of mourners and people in attendance at the funeral, and who they were.... colleagues, workmates, friends etc, even a reference to C.A.C.

[happymanoftheworld]

Hi all. Many thanks for efforts and suggestions..... to each a reply in reverse order....
Dickiesam - I know he died in Manchester - and I know I met him, therefore it must have been after 1953 and Marion Wilson died about 1966 but there is still a lot of Dave Johnsons and as he is a side-shoot I have never bothered researching him. I even tried to find the marriage of david and Marion just now using my last Rootsuk credits but to no avail. I will have to buy more credits and extend the search years. It would be just my luck for Dave to be his nickname!!! I shall be doing so as time (and wife!!! - she "doesn't do dead people") permits. Problem is I live in Scotland and I don't think the |Manchester Evening News has an on-line facility but will try..... but an excellent idea.
Blue 70 - a good thought but as he lived in Liverpool and the watch was from Liverpool I would doubt that it was a Mcr are club..... bearing in mind that I am only assuming it was athletics because I was told he was a keen athlete. It could easily be a religious group or quite possibly a "boys club" although funding for a 18ct gold watch for so little years of service makes that questionable. In fact I cannot for the world of me think of any reason for just six years to make "gold" --- except the Liverpool Mafia!
MaryA - The watchmaker is a good idea - I think he may have been quite prolific as there are 5 watches by him for sale on ebay at the moment.... they all have black fingers but mine has gold fingers so I think that it must have been top of the range. There is one thing that your watchmakers idea threw up ---- I had another look at the watch and apart from the 18ct hallmarks there is a number 8520 which I might be a stock number.... hopefully not a model number. I didn't realise Find my past had newpapers.... wil try to check. I am already in trouble - dogs should have been fed!!

Thank you to all.

[happymanoftheworld]

Following up on the watch forum suggestion I got diverted and googled Thomas Russell. This was a page I found that might be of particular interest to the forum. It is a page that is worth copying to your computers as if you just click on the google link the page does not come up. I t is only available through the Google cached pages - hence the very long link I have given here, http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s ... clnk&gl=uk however I found it very interesting indeed.... and I noted from it that they opened a shop in Manchester - which adds yet another complication..... I hope that there is a newspaper report somewhere.

[MaryA]

Didn't realise you didn't have the marriage, it took place in 1931 Manchester, St. Ann & St. Mary. If you want to order the certificate from the GRO the details are

David Johnson and Marian Wilson Q3 1931 Manchester North 8d 1292.

I would think it well worth investigating the Manchester link that Blue suggested.

[dickiesam]

Hi,
I strongly suggest you get the marriage cert that MaryA found. That will give you David's occupation and his father's name and occupation. More importantly you will have his given age from which you can find his birth year. That year will be a great help in finding his death. From the death cert you will have his last occupation and home address. The latter will help pinpoint the 'local' newspapers.

[happymanoftheworld]

I completely agree - I will send for it tomorrow from GRO. As you say, it will give his father's name which, if David had moved by the time of marriage, might l help me place him in 1920. I do know where he died Rusholme Manchester, and on BMD it is showing two or three around that time so I need his age..... then Manchester Evening News - though not as hopeful that direction. Thanks again. And Mary of course!

[dickiesam]

Re possible deaths... Without David's YoB it is still possible to have a shot at finding his death. When he married in 1931 he had to be 18 or more. That puts the latest YoB as 1913. If you are sure he died in Manchester and you know it was after 1955, a search for a Lancashire death in 1965 +/- 10 years with a YoB of 1903 +/- 10 years gave only two hits in Manchester....

DAVID JOHNSON
Age at death: 62
Year 1955; Mar qtr
Year Of Birth: 1893
District: MANCHESTER
Volume: 10E; Page: 477

DAVID JOHNSON
Age At Death: 53
Year 1955; Mar qtr.
Year Of Birth: 1902
District: MANCHESTER
Volume: 10E; Page: 312

Using the same technique there is only one hit for Marian's death...
MARIAN JOHNSON
Age at death: 71
Year 1969; Mar qtr
Year Of Birth: 1898
District: MANCHESTER
Volume: 10E; Page: 259

[happymanoftheworld]

Hi all --- many thanks for your help... because of some of your posts I eventually traced David. My dad must have been very inventive because it seems David never left Collyhurst/Ancoats until 1930. The census shows him clearly in 1901 and 1911. Regarding Clayton A C - Clayton le-moors would have been the equivalent of the other side of the earth in those days HOWEVER there is a Clayton in Manchester very close to Collyhurst and so I will be trying to find out more. Regarding the watchmaker red-herring...... they had a branch in Market St Manchester! Many thanks to you all and sorry that I have no relatives whatsoever in Manchester ---- buyt I do have an oil painting I bought years ago by Fowler!

[MaryA]

Glad you have a good result for part of your search anyway and something to look into also.

sorry that I have no relatives whatsoever in Manchester

Nor have most of us, we are mainly interested in Liverpool and the south west part of Lancashire, but that's not to say that we aren't happy to help.